Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

agfundernews.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 58 posts

Re: Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

#31

Post by omginternets »

DanI-S wrote: post #5
wnevets wrote: post #3

IIRC it's been shown that cricket farming at scale is no more effective than cow/chicken farming

I'm one of the founders of Tiny Farms. I think you're probably recalling an article published in PLOS ONE last year that suggested the sustainability of crickets might not meet the hype. We were obviously very interested in the study! It turns out that the paper missed some crucial factors that make insects a sustainable, efficient protein source. I guest-wrote this post with some details; do take a look if you're in…

Criticizing a peer-reviewed study is both healthy and welcome, but it really should be done with peer-reviewed studies of one's own. Respectfully, all I see here are extraordinary claims without any evidence, extraordinary or otherwise.

Re: Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

#32

Post by maxerickson »

Mz wrote: post #27
maxerickson wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry to step on your harmless joke, but big insects can't breathe: https://bioteaching.wordpress.com/2012/03/24/gigantism-in-in...

While that exact realization did make me stop being freaked out by giant spiders in movies, technically "they can't breathe" in earth's current atmosphere. Presumably, if it was worth the expense involved, you could grow giant insects in closed biomes with higher oxygen levels and (I assume) higher atmospheric pressure. Also: Jurassic Park is BS for the same reason. The T Rex would not function in earth's current atm…

Even then they probably didn't get much bigger than a cat.

http://listverse.com/2013/01/14/10-prehistoric-bugs-that-cou...

The huge dragonflys were still only somewhere between a crow and raven in size.

Re: Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

#33

Post by noondip »

blacksmith_tb wrote: post #24
noondip wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's possible to eat plants and end up not getting all essential amino acids No, that isn't possible. You could eat nothing but potatoes, or even mangoes, and still get enough protein. There isn't a single whole plant food which is completely lacking in any essential amino acid. How could it? Plants can't "hunt" and "eat" other plants - they must synthesize all amino acids themselves. The "complete protein" myth is…

Because plants are not animals, and we are? "Nearly all foods contain all twenty amino acids in some quantity... Proportions vary, however, and most plant foods are deficient in one or more of the essential amino acids."[1] [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complete_protein

Deficient means there are lower levels of certain amino acids, but they're not missing entirely. It wouldn't make any biological sense for plants to be missing amino acids. If you read the actual cited source, you will find this:

> Usual dietary combinations of plant proteins are complete; specific plant proteins may be low in specific amino acids

> There is no evidence that amino acid imbalances per se are important; possible imbalances can be created by inappropriate amino acid supplementation, but this is not a practical problem.

Re: Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

#34

Post by Mz »

maxerickson wrote: post #32
Mz wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While that exact realization did make me stop being freaked out by giant spiders in movies, technically "they can't breathe" in earth's current atmosphere. Presumably, if it was worth the expense involved, you could grow giant insects in closed biomes with higher oxygen levels and (I assume) higher atmospheric pressure. Also: Jurassic Park is BS for the same reason. The T Rex would not function in earth's current atm…

Even then they probably didn't get much bigger than a cat. http://listverse.com/2013/01/14/10-prehistoric-bugs-that-cou... The huge dragonflys were still only somewhere between a crow and raven in size.

Well, I don't know what the limits would be on size, but you seem to be presuming that historical limits are hard limits. I think that is as much a mistake as assuming current sizes are hard limits. It might take crazy levels of oxygen and pressure or it might be undoable, but if we were to create environments for this purpose, hell, why stick to recreating historic earth conditions?

Re: Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

#35

Post by jonnathanson »

felipemora wrote: post #28
duncancarroll wrote: post #10

As someone who once owned geckos and fed them with crickets, the memory of the smell alone is enough to deter me from ever eating any cricket-based product.

Seafood can be quite stinky also and yet lots of people have no problem eating it.

Exactly. And honestly, if you've ever eaten a whole, unpeeled shrimp or prawn before, it's not too much of a stretch going from there to something like crickets. They are both arthropods. They are distantly related. They look kinda-sorta-not-too-dissimilar in their natural state.

The key difference is size. There's a lot more meat in your typical prawn, and this allows you to peal and prep it in a way that distances you from its natural appearance. There's less meat inside the cricket, so you pretty much have to eat it whole, shell and all. The resulting texture is less meaty and more mealy/crunchy.

In my experience eating crickets, I've always been aware that I'm eating crickets. There is no fantastic way to mitigate the texture and the mouthfeel, shy of grinding up the crickets into a powder and reconstituting them in some other form.

(The texture doesn't bug me per se, but it sure does seem to bug a lot of people who've tried crickets. No pun intended.)

Re: Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

#36

Post by xexers »

wnevets wrote: post #3

IIRC it's been shown that cricket farming at scale is no more effective than cow/chicken farming

Don't lump chickens and cows together (the study doesn't). Beef Cattle are much less efficient in both water and grain usage than chickens.

http://www.care2.com/causes/cow-versus-chicken-the-true-carb...

Re: Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

#37

Post by avivo »

omginternets wrote: post #31
DanI-S wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm one of the founders of Tiny Farms. I think you're probably recalling an article published in PLOS ONE last year that suggested the sustainability of crickets might not meet the hype. We were obviously very interested in the study! It turns out that the paper missed some crucial factors that make insects a sustainable, efficient protein source. I guest-wrote this post with some details; do take a look if you're in…

Criticizing a peer-reviewed study is both healthy and welcome, but it really should be done with peer-reviewed studies of one's own. Respectfully, all I see here are extraordinary claims without any evidence, extraordinary or otherwise.

Are we reading the same "critique"? I don't see much in the way of extraordinary claims. In fact, most of the claims come directly from the paper! None of that post was criticizing the paper -- it was primarily clarifying the one sided news coverage.

The study says that crickets are not that much more efficient converters of plants->protein. The "clarification" accepts and applies the information from the study. It then takes into account an understanding of current processes in chicken cultivation to argue that overall impact on the environment would still likely be substantially reduced, especially with better technology.

Re: Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

#38

Post by panglott »

noondip wrote: post #16
theandrewbailey wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you want to eat protein, what do you eat? Meat. It usually comes from livestock (chicken, pork, beef, fish, etc). Crickets are far more sustainable than those conventional sources of protein.

As I had explained in the parent comment, all food has protein, so it's not necessary to specially source it from a particular food. Especially when that food appears extremely unpalatable (or am I the only one who doesn't salivate at the sight of crickets?).

The article talks about harvesting them by freeze drying them and milling them into a flour. Ultimately this is protein as a dietary supplement.

People are willing to pay high prices for meat because meat is tasty and features in numerous delicious recipes, as well as being a source of protein. Crickets would have to be much, much cheaper than meat if the intended market is cricket flour for protein supplementation.

Re: Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

#39

Post by jqm »

noondip wrote: post #16
theandrewbailey wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you want to eat protein, what do you eat? Meat. It usually comes from livestock (chicken, pork, beef, fish, etc). Crickets are far more sustainable than those conventional sources of protein.

As I had explained in the parent comment, all food has protein, so it's not necessary to specially source it from a particular food. Especially when that food appears extremely unpalatable (or am I the only one who doesn't salivate at the sight of crickets?).

All food may have protein, but all food does not have essential amino acids (which cannot be made by your body) in the quantities required to maintain health. This is why non-meat eaters must be sure to add certain foods (or certain combination of foods) to their diet if they want to stay healthy. Not bagging on vegetarianism, but the idea you can get sufficient protein by just eating any old plant is.... wrong. And animal protein is a far easier and certain way to get essential amino acids. This from a guy who was a vegetarian for a number of years.

Re: Tiny Farms Raises Seed Round as Cricket Farming Heats Up

#40

Post by duncancarroll »

felipemora wrote: post #28
duncancarroll wrote: post #10

As someone who once owned geckos and fed them with crickets, the memory of the smell alone is enough to deter me from ever eating any cricket-based product.

Seafood can be quite stinky also and yet lots of people have no problem eating it.

Sure, but I honestly can't think of a seafood product, raw or cooked that smells quite as bad as crickets do. Even when cooked they somehow retain the smell (I accidentally tried a "grashopper" taco once--turned out it was actually crickets--one bite was too much.)
Post reply on HN