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Google’s AMP Poised to Take the Lead from Facebook’s and Apple’s Walled Gardens

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Re: Google’s AMP Poised to Take the Lead from Facebook’s and Apple’s Walled Gardens

#31

Post by zaphar »

hackercomplex wrote: post #27

Keep in mind that the AMP caching infrastructure will also be able to serve as a tracking platform because it records every single IP address. This effectively grants Google and associates a defacto monopoly in terms of an unblockable mobile tracking platform in a world where ad-blockers are becoming ubiquitous. I think it's a smart move on their part actually, but what I assume will eventually happen is other provid…

    but ultimately people on the web prefer not to be tracked.
It's curious because most people on the web pay lip service to this preference but their actions typically indicate that they don't really care all that much. The folks on Hacker News are in the minority of users whose actions indicate they truly care.

Re: Google’s AMP Poised to Take the Lead from Facebook’s and Apple’s Walled Gardens

#32

Post by glossyscr »

I tried the AMP versions mentioned in the article on an iPhone 6 connected to wifi and I am not impressed at all.

Something which loads really instantly is D's forum, it's incredibly how fast it is and it's written in D:

http://forum.dlang.org/

(I am not into D, just found this thing recently on reddit/programming)

Re: Google’s AMP Poised to Take the Lead from Facebook’s and Apple’s Walled Gardens

#34

Post by cromwellian »

r1ch wrote: post #11
wanda wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using the same tool, I can see that my website loads in 440ms in the Netherlands. The homepage is 140kb, makes 6 requests, leverages caching and http/2 thanks to nginx etc. Which is great and everything, but for a reader in Texas, that becomes 1.2s thanks to the fact that my site is hosted in London. As you point out, AMP pages which weigh in at 4MB can be loaded in a seemingly underwhelming time: ~800ms. However, I…

You can always put Cloudflare in front of a site to get the same CDN benefit.

How do you know Cloudflare or other CDNs are participating with advertisers somehow, or responding to government tracking requests?

If the government can subpoena data from Google, are we sure they're not doing the same or more with CDNs, which don't seem as transparent as the consumer-facing companies.

Re: Google’s AMP Poised to Take the Lead from Facebook’s and Apple’s Walled Gardens

#35

Post by codemac »

zaphar wrote: post #31
hackercomplex wrote: post #27

Keep in mind that the AMP caching infrastructure will also be able to serve as a tracking platform because it records every single IP address. This effectively grants Google and associates a defacto monopoly in terms of an unblockable mobile tracking platform in a world where ad-blockers are becoming ubiquitous. I think it's a smart move on their part actually, but what I assume will eventually happen is other provid…

but ultimately people on the web prefer not to be tracked. It's curious because most people on the web pay lip service to this preference but their actions typically indicate that they don't really care all that much. The folks on Hacker News are in the minority of users whose actions indicate they truly care.

Nah, I think they don't have the time to get up to speed enough to even understand what it means to have their IP tracked, let alone understand the lengths they would have to go to avoid being tracked.

Most of my non-technical friends are super concerned, and frequently tell me how scary it is not knowing what to do or how to avoid it.

It's an active role the current ad-based industry takes to convince their users that the tracking either doesn't matter or somehow empowers the user, which are both demonstrably false.

Re: Google’s AMP Poised to Take the Lead from Facebook’s and Apple’s Walled Gardens

#36

Post by mark_l_watson »

hackercomplex wrote: post #27

Keep in mind that the AMP caching infrastructure will also be able to serve as a tracking platform because it records every single IP address. This effectively grants Google and associates a defacto monopoly in terms of an unblockable mobile tracking platform in a world where ad-blockers are becoming ubiquitous. I think it's a smart move on their part actually, but what I assume will eventually happen is other provid…

You nailed the problem with AMP: some people, like me, like to reduce the amount of tracking and general information gathering by corporations (and governments, but that is a different discussion). I stopped using Google Analytics (which is a great free product) because I wanted to reduce the tracking of people kind enough to visit my tech web sites and blog. If I were to use AMP, then my readers would get tracked.

Re: Google’s AMP Poised to Take the Lead from Facebook’s and Apple’s Walled Gardens

#37

Post by mark_l_watson »

franze wrote: post #6

ok, just to get this straight if a publisher want to do everything right in todays internet, they need * a responsive website * with views for desktop, mobile and tablet * optimized for search, social and conversion * optional: augmented with schema.org * an iphone app (one or more) * an android app * optional: tablet/ipad app * facebook channel * twitter channel * youtube channel * pinterest presence * whatsapp pres…

I am far from being an expert front end developer. I have found that a good match for my requirements and the amount of time I am willing to spend developing and maintaining my web sites is to simply use minimal Bootstrap themes and let media queries generate mobile and desktop versions of my sites.

Without too much hassle I can support all device types and as long as I am careful to use small image files and minimized JS and CSS, page load times are pretty good.

Re: Google’s AMP Poised to Take the Lead from Facebook’s and Apple’s Walled Gardens

#38

Post by dsparkman »

criddell wrote: post #30
mtgx wrote: post #7

I'm fine with it long as all content/analytics don't pass through Google, but I imagine many content sites will be lazy and let Google handle everything.

I wonder what happens when you combiner AMP pages and something like uBlock Origin? Do you get fast page loads AND minimal tracking?

Probably a blank screen since AMP requires this in your pages: body {opacity: 0}body {opacity: 1}

Re: Google’s AMP Poised to Take the Lead from Facebook’s and Apple’s Walled Gardens

#39

Post by x1024 »

JoBrad wrote: post #18
x1024 wrote: post #5

(The article said to "try any page from The Guardian with '/amp' to test its performance") Oh my: http://tools.pingdom.com/fpt/#!/bniZiH/https://www.theguardi... "Such mobile performance, wow". 4 megabytes of video(Preloading two different videos. Why?), maybe 10 different domains, downloading JS before downloading images... And this is the showcase for AMP. It's almost as if "there is no silver bullet" for web perfo…

They're pre-loading videos for the same reason Facebook does: if you post an article with a video, the video instantly plays, with little to no buffering.

"This kills the 3G data plan". At least with "the optimized for mobile" version, preloading should not happen. And it definitely shouldn't happen twice for the same video.

Re: Google’s AMP Poised to Take the Lead from Facebook’s and Apple’s Walled Gardens

#40

Post by x1024 »

Navarr wrote: post #15
theefer wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems you have chosen a bit of an edge case. Agreed the videos shouldn't pre-load, but to take a more standard example of a simple article: AMP: http://tools.pingdom.com/fpt/#!/brWXpA/http://www.theguardia... Requests: 67 Load time: 485ms Page size: 627.3kB Non-AMP: http://tools.pingdom.com/fpt/#!/eNuTPX/http://www.theguardia... Requests: 136 Load time: 2.88s Page size: 1.8MB And to be fair, note that the non-AMP…

Looking at the source - the videos aren't set to pre-load? And don't a lot of these sources only start loading once the page has finished rendering? AMP is supposed to be fast-to-render firstmost, right?

It should "be optimized for mobile". 4MB per page is anything but. If you visit 100 pages per day, you'd need a 12GB data plan.
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