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Things I've learned at Google so far

bentilly.blogspot.com

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Re: Things I've learned at Google so far

#31

Post by btilly »

csomar wrote: post #20

In fact this is enshrined as an official corporate policy - engineers get 20% of their time to do with pretty much as they please, and are judged in part on how they use that time. I found a speech claiming that over half of Google's applications started as a 20% project. >> (I'm surprised that the figure is so low.) I wonder why you are surprised? Actually it's very high. Imagine Google don't offer 20% for its' empl…

The figure that I thought was low is that only about 50% of Google applications started as 20% projects.

I have no issue with only 20% of your time being officially set aside for side projects.

Re: Things I've learned at Google so far

#32

Post by fexl »

csomar wrote: post #24
ThinkWriteMute wrote: post #17

I like Google as a company and I love their products (As much as you can love a tool), but jesus how can he work there and use Blogger? It's such a piece of crap.

What's wrong with Blogger? It does its' job well. What's the point from Blogging? -> Getting the word to the others. and it does it well, so it's not crap.

I like blogger.com. Just yesterday I fired up a blog for my wife's retail clothing store. Now she can do all that stuff herself instead of relying on her custom-programmer husband. :)

Re: Things I've learned at Google so far

#33

Post by petercooper »

neilk wrote: post #28
petercooper wrote: post #13

Google has amazing people. It is often said that engineers find working at Google a humbling experience. This is absolutely true. It took me less than a day to realize that the guy sitting next to me is clearly much smarter than I am [..] without false modesty I wouldn't be surprised to find that I'm as high as being in the top 0.1% in general intelligence (however that could be measured). This strikes me as a proble…

Google believes in data only . Designers are not used to justifying their ideas with data. While no one comes out and says it, the implication is that most of what constitutes the design profession is mere flimflammery. You don't need a designer to tell you what shade of blue to pick when you can just A/B test a few hundred shades. That's why a lot of designers quit.

Can you imagine if they used those sorts of techniques to refine TV schedules? You'd end up with non stop reality and talent shows. Oh, hang on..

Re: Things I've learned at Google so far

#34

Post by gritzko »

jodrellblank wrote: post #7
gritzko wrote: post #2

Blah-blah, Google is so cool, nothing worth reading, actually.

* Blah-blah, Google is so cool, nothing worth reading, actually.* Bit like your comment. Hence the downvote. It is interesting that someone from the outside has now joined Google and found a lot that they would like to say, but can't. I've also seen anecdotal evidence that the 20% time is largely ignored and up to the employee to push for, but he comments that it's both used a lot and you are marked on it. I guess th…

Sorry, but I can't lie to you. I heard all that Google campus stories a zillion times, except probably for j-k buttons, which are hinted at the bottom of the GMail page, right? Downvote at will.

Re: Things I've learned at Google so far

#35

Post by dirtyaura »

neilk wrote: post #28
petercooper wrote: post #13

Google has amazing people. It is often said that engineers find working at Google a humbling experience. This is absolutely true. It took me less than a day to realize that the guy sitting next to me is clearly much smarter than I am [..] without false modesty I wouldn't be surprised to find that I'm as high as being in the top 0.1% in general intelligence (however that could be measured). This strikes me as a proble…

Google believes in data only . Designers are not used to justifying their ideas with data. While no one comes out and says it, the implication is that most of what constitutes the design profession is mere flimflammery. You don't need a designer to tell you what shade of blue to pick when you can just A/B test a few hundred shades. That's why a lot of designers quit.

Bullshit. For example, do you honestly think that Android UI was done in a data-driven way from the scratch without designers?

Google uses data to tweak experience of their existing products like Search UI. That's it. Designing interfaces for new products or features is done by designers (or in some case, like many Google Labs products, by developers).

Re: Things I've learned at Google so far

#36

Post by ThinkWriteMute »

btilly wrote: post #29
ThinkWriteMute wrote: post #17

I like Google as a company and I love their products (As much as you can love a tool), but jesus how can he work there and use Blogger? It's such a piece of crap.

The answer is that I'm engaging in satisficing behavior, not optimizing behavior. When I wanted to start a blog it was there and free. I've seen lots of other people use it. And so far it has been good enough for my needs. If I was a serious blogger I'd likely find things I didn't like about it and look for something better. But until some obvious shortcoming irritates me, it isn't worth the effort for me to find som…

Ok, so you freely admit that there are (probably) things that are wrong with it if you looked hard enough.

...So why isn't it better?

EDIT TO ADD: You know, this is really part of the bigger problem. Google has a fair amount of side services that just barely scoot by and it's pretty stupid. Example: Google is a search engine company, but their Chrome Extension Search page HAS NO SEARCH FEATURES.

Re: Things I've learned at Google so far

#37

Post by ThinkWriteMute »

csomar wrote: post #24
ThinkWriteMute wrote: post #17

I like Google as a company and I love their products (As much as you can love a tool), but jesus how can he work there and use Blogger? It's such a piece of crap.

What's wrong with Blogger? It does its' job well. What's the point from Blogging? -> Getting the word to the others. and it does it well, so it's not crap.

If getting it done was the only objective then why isn't Blogger just a web server that people can FTP self written HTML files to?

Blogger has a lot of paper cuts that slowly make it either unbearable to use or unsightly to visit.

It takes me 4 refreshes just to comment on a page.

Re: Things I've learned at Google so far

#38

Post by dsspence »

neilk wrote: post #28
petercooper wrote: post #13

Google has amazing people. It is often said that engineers find working at Google a humbling experience. This is absolutely true. It took me less than a day to realize that the guy sitting next to me is clearly much smarter than I am [..] without false modesty I wouldn't be surprised to find that I'm as high as being in the top 0.1% in general intelligence (however that could be measured). This strikes me as a proble…

Google believes in data only . Designers are not used to justifying their ideas with data. While no one comes out and says it, the implication is that most of what constitutes the design profession is mere flimflammery. You don't need a designer to tell you what shade of blue to pick when you can just A/B test a few hundred shades. That's why a lot of designers quit.

I think this is the link you are referring to: http://stopdesign.com/archive/2009/03/20/goodbye-google.html

Re: Things I've learned at Google so far

#39

Post by neilk »

dirtyaura wrote: post #35
neilk wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google believes in data only . Designers are not used to justifying their ideas with data. While no one comes out and says it, the implication is that most of what constitutes the design profession is mere flimflammery. You don't need a designer to tell you what shade of blue to pick when you can just A/B test a few hundred shades. That's why a lot of designers quit.

Bullshit. For example, do you honestly think that Android UI was done in a data-driven way from the scratch without designers? Google uses data to tweak experience of their existing products like Search UI. That's it. Designing interfaces for new products or features is done by designers (or in some case, like many Google Labs products, by developers).

You're right, I should have qualified that. That said, there are a lot of people working as designers in Google, but in my experience they are essentially user interaction designers.

The more woolly aspects of design -- like picking a different font just because of how it "feels" -- Google's pretty hostile to that. There's a default concept of "Googliness" which everyone understands to be a kind of high-energy, primary-color blandness with near-magical UI. There aren't a lot of projects that deviate from that, no matter what the designer thinks.

If you compare it to the kind of design variety you see at Yahoo or even Microsoft you'll see what I mean. At Yahoo a lot of projects are almost led by design, for good (Flickr) or ill (almost everything else). And there are design principles of Flickr which Google could never accept, like "serendipity". The idea that a user interface could be deliberately not laser-efficient, in the name of promoting exploration and community engagement, would totally baffle Google managers and they wouldn't tolerate that kind of designer-talk.

Re: Things I've learned at Google so far

#40

Post by hello_moto »

clistctrl wrote: post #5
hello_moto wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed... it's like judging the whole book when in reality he just finished the "preface" part.

I've only met two googlers in real life. One past, one present. Both talk about google like its a great place, but both seem slightly spent/burnt from the place.

Oh... I was referring to the fact that the author just completed his first month at Google...

It's hard to judge a company just in one month especially when some people might spend their first week (or two) doing company orientation.

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