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A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

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Re: A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

#31

Post by jinushaun »

gozo wrote: post #9

I'm always split when reading stories like this. On the one hand, I really feel for the person and appreciate her sharing. Problems like these rarely consider the practicality of the situation and shouldn't be taken lightly. On the other, I know there are kids out there who never got to go to a good school, always had problems at home and never got to feel the joy of learning. They can't write this kind of story and…

100x Yes!

I had a similar argument recently. It was all fun and games talking about the problems with traditional education and the loss of creative thinking until I pointed out that the only reason we can have this debate is because we went to good schools, got good grades and got good jobs.

As someone who grew up poor and extremely grateful to get out of the ghetto, I'm consistently surprised that I'm surrounded by unhappy well-off peers who have similar struggles and offer similar advice (quit job/school, follow your heart, travel, go to Burning Man, etc). These are lamentations and luxuries of the leisure class. Money doesn't buy happiness, but everything still costs money. When you satisfy 90% of what most people define as needed to keep them happy and comfortable, that last 10% takes over your world. In a post scarcity society, we are all trapped at the top of Maslow's hierarchy of needs and happiness seems harder and harder to achieve. Instead of being happy with what we have, we keep moving the bar.

Don't get me wrong, the author's problems are real and valid, and there is something wrong with our society when kids start committing suicide over GPAs, but a large part of me fears for our future. Maybe Star Trek really is a dystopia…

Re: A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

#32

Post by mwhuang2 »

My peers in high school were overachievers who seemed to have everything figured out. I had no idea what I was doing and often had close to failing grades, despite scoring high on standardized tests (2390 SAT + 800 SAT II Math).

I got rejected from almost every college I applied to and ended up dropping out after a year when I actually did go. I worked two jobs and took community college classes for a year before returning to university.

I'm definitely more focused and mature now. I think people shouldn't feel the need to conform to the "normal" path of going off to college right away. There's really no single correct way to go through life. I needed time to figure things out for myself instead of adhering to a system I wasn't comfortable in.

Re: A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

#33

Post by tailgate »

roghummal wrote: post #17
cloudier wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The equivalent Western stereotype is probably the neckbeard. It's prevalent enough to have shown up in mainstream media, e.g. South Park's Make Love, Not Warcraft.

What do you call a female neckbeard, then?

Generally some version of spinster, future crazy cat lady, etc;

Re: A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

#34

Post by dropit_sphere »

jinushaun wrote: post #31
gozo wrote: post #9

I'm always split when reading stories like this. On the one hand, I really feel for the person and appreciate her sharing. Problems like these rarely consider the practicality of the situation and shouldn't be taken lightly. On the other, I know there are kids out there who never got to go to a good school, always had problems at home and never got to feel the joy of learning. They can't write this kind of story and…

100x Yes! I had a similar argument recently. It was all fun and games talking about the problems with traditional education and the loss of creative thinking until I pointed out that the only reason we can have this debate is because we went to good schools, got good grades and got good jobs. As someone who grew up poor and extremely grateful to get out of the ghetto, I'm consistently surprised that I'm surrounded by…

Are people impressed that you got out of the ghetto? Would people be as impressed if, say, a Kennedy your age was where you are now?

I guess I'm just agreeing with you. Everybody takes some knocks---which is ensured by the fact that some knocks are caused by not having had any.

Re: A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

#35

Post by jokoon »

ZenoArrow wrote: post #29
jokoon wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really believe the person in the article is just strongly introverted, and that's it. School puts a lot of pressure into socializing students, without caring about individual sensitivities. I personally hate working with other people, and there are actually plenty of people who do. Learning is a tedious task, so I'll never understand why school must be social. There is always the same situation that occurs to me. S…

> "Some guy just start talking to me while I'm doing something." Have you tried the headphones trick? Works for me. You don't even have to be listening to music. > "Interacting has become a standard." Without putting too fine a point on it, it's always been the standard. You only exist now because your predecessors interacted. I hear you that there's a time and place for interaction, and you shouldn't feel pressured…

> You only exist now because your predecessors interacted.

You mean sex ? I don't think you need to be social to see sex happening.

> However, if you label yourself as 'introvert' or 'extrovert' you limit your potential experiences, and I don't see the point in that.

Yeah, that's why introversion/extroversion is called a spectrum, even an introvert needs to be social once in a while.

Also I'm sure introvert people have been kept away from being well integrated into society because there are much less communities of people living together, we all have our own kitchen and shower, which will inevitably isolate people won't don't seek social contact.

The problem is that extroversion is rewarded, not introversion. It becomes a problem when you requires for degrees to include social interaction into group projects. That was my experience and it really marked how I failed at school, while I'm sure I'm more intelligent and capable than the average.

The problem is the creation of a set of rules to put incentives on people to interact, instead of letting them interact naturally.

Re: A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

#36

Post by ambicapter »

jokoon wrote: post #35
ZenoArrow wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Some guy just start talking to me while I'm doing something." Have you tried the headphones trick? Works for me. You don't even have to be listening to music. > "Interacting has become a standard." Without putting too fine a point on it, it's always been the standard. You only exist now because your predecessors interacted. I hear you that there's a time and place for interaction, and you shouldn't feel pressured…

> You only exist now because your predecessors interacted. You mean sex ? I don't think you need to be social to see sex happening. > However, if you label yourself as 'introvert' or 'extrovert' you limit your potential experiences, and I don't see the point in that. Yeah, that's why introversion/extroversion is called a spectrum, even an introvert needs to be social once in a while. Also I'm sure introvert people ha…

> You mean sex ? I don't think you need to be social to see sex happening.

Uh, can you clarify.

Re: A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

#37

Post by tashoecraft »

forthefuture wrote: post #19

So I'm a similar situation except I'm hopelessly introverted. The idea of a bootcamp seems good to my parents, but to me it's just another word for school. At this point it would be easier to get a computer science degree than to do a bootcamp because doing work in groups is the first thing I check for on a syllabus before I drop a class. It sure looks good though, pay $15,000 for a 97% chance at getting a job. I jus…

As someone who is currently finishing up Fullstack, you do have to work in groups but it isn't the bullshit you have to do in college. You pair program with different people each day to work through workshops. You work in groups on projects, but everyone pulls their weight and it isn't at all what I had experience in groups in college. If you don't know how to work in a group, then you don't know everything you need to get a job. Pairing and working on teams is going to be your life as a programmer, so you are going to need to learn it. If you are at all interested and it is something you can do I'd highly recommend applying. It will push you to work with people, but it is a supportive community that'll insure you do well.

Re: A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

#38

Post by 55555 »

mwhuang2 wrote: post #32

My peers in high school were overachievers who seemed to have everything figured out. I had no idea what I was doing and often had close to failing grades, despite scoring high on standardized tests (2390 SAT + 800 SAT II Math). I got rejected from almost every college I applied to and ended up dropping out after a year when I actually did go. I worked two jobs and took community college classes for a year before ret…

You had a 2390 on your SATs and were rejected from colleges?

Re: A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

#39

Post by mwhuang2 »

55555 wrote: post #38
mwhuang2 wrote: post #32

My peers in high school were overachievers who seemed to have everything figured out. I had no idea what I was doing and often had close to failing grades, despite scoring high on standardized tests (2390 SAT + 800 SAT II Math). I got rejected from almost every college I applied to and ended up dropping out after a year when I actually did go. I worked two jobs and took community college classes for a year before ret…

You had a 2390 on your SATs and were rejected from colleges?

I applied mostly to Ivies and similarly competitive colleges. They get plenty of applicants with near-perfect test scores and GPAs, so my poor grades made me a subpar candidate.

Re: A Culture Against Dropouts, Deviants and Troubled Young Adults

#40

Post by theVirginian »

55555 wrote: post #38
mwhuang2 wrote: post #32

My peers in high school were overachievers who seemed to have everything figured out. I had no idea what I was doing and often had close to failing grades, despite scoring high on standardized tests (2390 SAT + 800 SAT II Math). I got rejected from almost every college I applied to and ended up dropping out after a year when I actually did go. I worked two jobs and took community college classes for a year before ret…

You had a 2390 on your SATs and were rejected from colleges?

It can look bad to have high test scores and poor grades because it implies you were a lazy student. It's not a sentiment that I agree with but our guidance counselors basically put it to us that way.
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