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Microsoft new Outlook takes 10 seconds to do what Outlook Classic does instantly

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Re: Microsoft new Outlook takes 10 seconds to do what Outlook Classic does instantly

#291

Post by 9x39 »

impendia wrote: post #227
thewebguyd wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I understand there are some missing features compared to the old one There are some people that use Outlook for...well I'm not sure what but things that go way beyond email and calendar. I've been using the web app for several years now, it's fine. When I was new in IT, I always struggled to see what the big deal was with Outlook desktop. The web mail has folders, rules, shared mailbox support, integrated calendar,…

> People treat email has a permanent data store. Is this strange? I'll be trying to solve some problem, half-remember an email conversation from several years ago on something relevant, and want to look it up. This feels like the most natural thing in the world to me, and it's not like the ability to save emails is new. Why, exactly, would a forced change of habits be for my own good?

>Why, exactly, would a forced change of habits be for my own good?

At the personal level, it wouldn't be. It makes a lot of sense, and I do the same with Fastmail.

At the corp level where it's often in M365 cloud, you've got hard limits from Microsoft on one hand (100GB primary mailbox - period), and corporate data retention limits on the other. Legal often has strong opinions on how long you are allowed to retain emails which you may or may not be able to personally override. Could be just a few years, which forces a different strategy.

I'm not sure on the details of Google, but one imagines corp workspaces have equivalent interests.

Re: Microsoft new Outlook takes 10 seconds to do what Outlook Classic does instantly

#292

Post by 9x39 »

netsharc wrote: post #5

Started a new job, with Windows 11. notepad.exe now takes 3 to 4 seconds to load on my work system... (even after closing the last tab and reopening the program). Hah, it even has in-app purchases, for AI writing...

It's sad. Further compounding the problem like siblings have said is enterprise security stack stuff - EDRs/XDRs, app control, firewalls, productivity police nonsense.

The second thing is that enterprises typically don't have someone fighting for the desktop UX to remain usable when PC fleets go up for purchase - pick the cheapest toilet paper is often the strategy of the day. Now you have a PC that hits a bargain price point that seemed attractive on some analysis to the CFO, it's been saddled with security software that saps 50% of the limited performance to begin with.

Re: Microsoft new Outlook takes 10 seconds to do what Outlook Classic does instantly

#293

Post by 9x39 »

Plasmoid2000ad wrote: post #95
netsharc wrote: post #5

Started a new job, with Windows 11. notepad.exe now takes 3 to 4 seconds to load on my work system... (even after closing the last tab and reopening the program). Hah, it even has in-app purchases, for AI writing...

Lot's of enterprises are enabling whitelisting of apps launching using some sort of tooling - I think Microsoft provides one, and CrowdStrike etc. It's likely the delay involves a call to a backend application or even sometimes a web server. This would be on top of real-time scanning of every file before it's opened.

Yes, it's usually a filter driver that delays execution until something like a hash is checked or other rules evaluate. Some products hash every interesting/executable file on the PC. They're powerful tools but can be extremely performance-sapping.

Re: Microsoft new Outlook takes 10 seconds to do what Outlook Classic does instantly

#294

Post by doubled112 »

esikich wrote: post #257
yoyohello13 wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I'm worried about the day when infosec turns it's eye toward WSL. So far they have turned a blind eye, but just wait until someone cooks up an exploit targeting WSL...

In my experience they just block it in corporate environments.

They don't explicitly block it in my org, but connecting to VPN while it's running breaks the networking inside WSL.

Sometimes it is routed from the VPN, sometimes it is DNS, sometimes it just needs a restart. I'm not sure if that situation has improved. There were some workarounds at one point.

Re: Microsoft new Outlook takes 10 seconds to do what Outlook Classic does instantly

#295

Post by 9x39 »

fluoridation wrote: post #238
maccard wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not IT, I'm' just the senior most engineer in a game studio. Ive got WPA captures that point to windows defender, even with processes and folders excluded. But I have literally no idea what to do with those traces, hence my 99% conviction.

If it's that bad, why not just disable it?

Enterprise versions are tamper-protected.

Re: Microsoft new Outlook takes 10 seconds to do what Outlook Classic does instantly

#296

Post by fluoridation »

9x39 wrote: post #295
fluoridation wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's that bad, why not just disable it?

Enterprise versions are tamper-protected.

Can you not dual boot into something else and delete the executable?

Re: Microsoft new Outlook takes 10 seconds to do what Outlook Classic does instantly

#298

Post by __natty__ »

> Windows 11 ships with two versions of Outlook. There is Outlook Classic, the long-running Win32 desktop app built for power users, and there is the new Outlook, which Microsoft is pushing as the future of email on Windows. The newer one is built on WebView2 and is, in essence, a browser window that loads Outlook.com. If you have ever used both side by side, you already know which one feels faster and which one does not.

This is bizarre. Kyle Rubenok, according to his LinkedIn and GitHub @krubenok, is the senior manager for the outlook product. Isn't he taking any responsibility for how poorly his product performs? In many regular companies, such a manager would be fired for managing a product into decline. I guess I don't understand how big US corporations work.

Re: Microsoft new Outlook takes 10 seconds to do what Outlook Classic does instantly

#299

Post by 9x39 »

fluoridation wrote: post #296
9x39 wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Enterprise versions are tamper-protected.

Can you not dual boot into something else and delete the executable?

Disk encryption is also mandated in most enterprises.

I do not mean to patronize, it's just the enterprise-y stuff has tried locking down the PCs for exactly this reason - deleting the security tools when they're not loaded would be of course very effective.

On top of that, showing such motivation can expose people to violating the 782 commandments of whatever corporate IT policy someone had to sign to get a paycheck.

Rare is the security vs usability compromise in these companies that accounts for the need for high performance desktops, sadly.

Re: Microsoft new Outlook takes 10 seconds to do what Outlook Classic does instantly

#300

Post by zchrykng »

Jakob wrote: post #141
zchrykng wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Got an example of a well-implemented natice app for email? I'm bugged by some bugs with the Fastmail app, but have generally had a better experience with it than any other client I've tried. Search in particular is far better on the Fastmail app.

I really like Mimestream, which is a native client for Gmail. Very fast and supports all the usual native macOS keyboard navigation, e.g. shift or command to amend selection in a list.

I've heard good things about it, for sure, but I'd argue that it isn't really an Email client. It is a Gmail client as it doesn't work with anything else. Fastmail is in the same bucket, but it is part of my contention about there not being good Email apps generally.
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