Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom • Hacker News Board

Re: Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom

#291

Post by graemep » Thu, Apr 02, 2026, 5:20 PM UTC

fasterik wrote: post #262

kpw94 wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not using tech that you're describing here. You're talking about literally learning some basic computer skills (such as word processor, excel, reading email, some basic website building, use printer, and some amount of programming) For those, obviously you need a computer and completely agree that those are important skills to learn... But you maybe need to spend 1h/week during last 2 years of middle school on…

Would it be a mistake to use Desmos in a math classroom, or 3Blue1Brown style animations, to build up visual intuition? Should we not teach basic numerical and statistical methods in Python? Should kids be forced to use physical copies of newspapers and journal articles instead of learning how to look things up in a database? I'm all for going back to analog where it makes sense, but it seems wrongheaded to completel…

Those are great examples. Not familiar with Desmos, but 3Blue1Brown style animations are great.

The problem is that people seem to want to go to extremes. Either go all out on doing everything in tablets or not use any technology in education at all.

its not just work skills, its also a better understanding that is gained from things such as the maths animations you mentioned.

Re: Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom

#292

Post by pesus » Thu, Apr 02, 2026, 5:20 PM UTC

duskdozer wrote: post #163

Gigachad wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep hearing this at work but so far no one has explained what “learning ai” actually means. It seems to just be nonsense like those people selling prompt recipes or claiming to be prompt engineers. No one needs training in prompting AI. I could understand if they meant a deeper layer of integrating tech with systems but all they ever mean is typing things in to a text box.

Presumably prompting skills like https://github.com/califio/publications/blob/main/MADBugs/CV...

Are these supposed to be the "skilled" prompts? This just reads as a basic conversation and not as particularly well-written or well-defined prompts. So far everything I've seen about prompting "skills" has just come down to being able to articulate and critically think a bit.

Re: Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom

#293

Post by graemep » Thu, Apr 02, 2026, 5:21 PM UTC

fasterik wrote: post #229

pier25 wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's important that children gain basic technical literacy They certainly will at home. > I suspect there is a gap in the technical literacy of lower income students, whose parents are less likely to have a computer at home. In which country? I live in Mexico and even here you really need to go to the poorest families to find a home without a laptop. Even those families have multiple smartphones. Today a smartphone…

Even if they have a computer at home, that doesn't mean they're practicing the relevant skills. Touch typing, word processing, researching a topic online, etc. are things that need deliberate practice. Based on my own experience, using a computer at home 99% of the time meant playing video games. The following article suggests that in the United States, about 59% of lower income households have a laptop or desktop co…

Yes. Kids can learn a lot of they do use computers to do things like research things.

Re: Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom

#294

Post by bpt3 » Thu, Apr 02, 2026, 5:22 PM UTC

fasterik wrote: post #262

kpw94 wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not using tech that you're describing here. You're talking about literally learning some basic computer skills (such as word processor, excel, reading email, some basic website building, use printer, and some amount of programming) For those, obviously you need a computer and completely agree that those are important skills to learn... But you maybe need to spend 1h/week during last 2 years of middle school on…

Would it be a mistake to use Desmos in a math classroom, or 3Blue1Brown style animations, to build up visual intuition? Should we not teach basic numerical and statistical methods in Python? Should kids be forced to use physical copies of newspapers and journal articles instead of learning how to look things up in a database? I'm all for going back to analog where it makes sense, but it seems wrongheaded to completel…

Until most kids are about 12 - 14 years old, they're learning much more basic concepts than you're describing. I don't think anyone is trying to take intro to computer science out of high schools or preventing an advanced student younger than that from the same.

I would rather a teacher have to draw a concept on a board than have each student watch an animation on their computer. Obviously, the teacher projecting the animation should be fine, but it seems like some educators and parents can't handle that and it turns into a slippery slope back to kids using devices.

So for most classrooms full of students in grades prior to high school, the answer to your list of (presumably rhetorical) questions is "Yes."

Re: Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom

#295

Post by graemep » Thu, Apr 02, 2026, 5:25 PM UTC

qurren wrote: post #239

pier25 wrote: post #199

I worked in EdTech about a decade ago and our education/pedagogy experts were already talking about this. They also talked a lot about how handwriting is super important for cognitive development. After working on that company for a couple of years I realized using tech in education (pre university) was a mistake. One of the reasons I left. In a decade or two the long term consequences of inundating kids with tech an…

> They also talked a lot about how handwriting is super important for cognitive development. Is it possible that there are alternative ways than handwriting for cognitive development? Probably in 500 BC they said you had to hack at stone with a chisel for cognitive development, and then someone invented the pen and paper. The difference is the task had to change as well. People were able to write thousands of pages (…

Maybe not that early, but writing did eventually undermine the ability to memorise things. It used to be common for people to memorise long works - it is one reason why epic poetry was popular and designed to be memorable. Memorising even a few hundred lines is unusual now.

I wonder whether it has contributed to the evolution of smaller brains: https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20240517-the-human-brain-...

Re: Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom

#296

Post by insane_dreamer » Thu, Apr 02, 2026, 5:27 PM UTC

100% support this. Computers in school -- except at specific times for specific purposes -- are a distraction. My teen told me he and his friends were watching Hulu in class on their Chromebooks because while the school district had locked down access to Netflix, Disney, etc., they forgot Hulu :/ The students also figured out ways to share links to game sites by using shared Google docs and using URLs that bypassed the school's controls.

The huge drop in scores during the pandemic, during which everyone switched to edTech, is pretty strong evidence that in classroom education is essential at the lower grades in particular.

Re: Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom

#297

Post by bpt3 » Thu, Apr 02, 2026, 5:27 PM UTC

weslleyskah wrote: post #274

pier25 wrote: post #199

I worked in EdTech about a decade ago and our education/pedagogy experts were already talking about this. They also talked a lot about how handwriting is super important for cognitive development. After working on that company for a couple of years I realized using tech in education (pre university) was a mistake. One of the reasons I left. In a decade or two the long term consequences of inundating kids with tech an…

Tech can save you from a bad educational environment. I think kids need extreme amounts of freedom with guidance on what are the best tools to be used for learning. From visualizing linear algebra and analytic geometry problems to piracy. If anything, the teachers need to improve their tech literacy. There is no way to be done away with tech on school, but some balance and freedom must be achieved.

> I think kids need extreme amounts of freedom with guidance on what are the best tools to be used for learning.

Why an "extreme" amount of freedom?

> There is no way to be done away with tech on school, but some balance and freedom must be achieved.

Yes there is. Students were educated just a couple decades ago without it. We can easily return to that style.

Re: Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom

#298

Post by MSFT_Edging » Thu, Apr 02, 2026, 5:29 PM UTC

zozbot234 wrote: post #162

MSFT_Edging wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds like the major issue here is the access to information. It's not the fault of the medium but rather the IP rights around it. Books are expensive because the text book industry needs their cut. Schools need to protect the expensive books because children can and will impulsively throw one off a bridge on their walk home. The digital editions are restricted due to IP, so you can't have an infinitely copyable…

Open content textbooks are widely available, it's just a matter of adoption by the students.

> it's just a matter of adoption by the students.

I don't think it's the students who are signing textbook deals.

Re: Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom

#299

Post by graemep » Thu, Apr 02, 2026, 5:30 PM UTC

muskyFelon wrote: post #140

TaupeRanger wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It tells us nothing. People act like this is some big hypocrisy or revelation. First of all, Jobs DID allow his children to use iPads, but it was limited. People take a single quote from the Isaacson biography out of context, assuming that he never let his children have access to iPads at all, forever. Other interviews he gave talked about limiting access - like ALL families should do. Jobs was literally just parenti…

Its a luxury that affluent people have to limit these things. When you're at your limit after a long day of work and still have stuff to do at home the kid gets the phone, iPad, or whatever while parents do the needed to run the household. Wonder why obesity is such a problem for poorer families. Convenience. Yes, tech companies are liable for pushing this technology that they know to be addictive. There is no apolog…

So how did people manage before we had these things?

Re: Sweden goes back to basics, swapping screens for books in the classroom

#300

Post by pessimizer » Thu, Apr 02, 2026, 5:30 PM UTC

logicchains wrote: post #117

gritspants wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see the advantage of learning 'AI workflows'. I am in the US and there seems to be a FOMO plague infecting our school system when it comes to technology. In practice it seems more destructive to the child.

>I don't see the advantage of learning 'AI workflows'. Eventually everything that can be learned from a book will be done much better by machines, so for humans to have any chance of being employable they'll need to develop the soft skill of working with intelligent machines.

If AI is still too stupid to show people how to work with it, and to notice their lacks and anticipate their needs, it can't have become that indispensably useful.

The entire point of AI is to accommodate the user. AI doesn't do anything that people can't do, is worse at most of those things, but is a lot faster at some of them (basically looking up things.) The point of AI is natural language UI.

Teaching people how to use AI is just teaching people enough about the world to give them something to ask AI for.