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Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

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Re: Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

#291

Post by fc417fc802 »

caconym_ wrote: post #284
fc417fc802 wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It isn't obvious, no. If I drop a hammer on my foot and break my toe I can't then blame the hardware store or the manufacturer. If the store didn't carry hammers I wouldn't have been able to purchase it, I think to myself. Then I couldn't possibly have dropped it on my foot, thus my toe wouldn't be broken right now. It's a specious line of reasoning. It doesn't matter in the slightest by what means she was selected t…

If you don't agree that facial recognition software is involved in a case of a woman being misidentified by facial recognition software then there is no point in me spending any more time/effort in conversation with you. Goodbye.

You seem to be intentionally ignoring the point I made. I never disputed that facial recognition software was used (ie involved).

The facial recognition tool didn't arrest her. It holds no authority, has no will of its own, and does not possess a corporeal form with which to enact change in the world. The only parties that could possibly be at fault here are various government agents who clearly acted with negligence, failing to uphold their duty to the law and the people.

If you're unable to rebut my point then perhaps you should consider that you might be in the wrong? If you're unwilling to entertain such a possibility then I wonder why you're posting here to begin with. What is your goal?

Re: Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

#292

Post by EchoReflection »

whack wrote: post #51

> According to the court documents, the Fargo detective working the case then looked at Lipps' social media accounts and Tennessee driver's license photo. In his charging document, the detective wrote that Lipps appeared to be the suspect based on facial features, body type and hairstyle and color. > Once they were in hand, Fargo police met with him and Lipps at the Cass County jail on Dec. 19. She had already been i…

100% 100% 100% humanity is so obsessed with ai that we're losing...our humanity. "blame the mindless, soulless robots! how could we have possibly known that they need to be supervised?! aren't they basically just humans that don't need to rest or eat?"

Re: Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

#293

Post by Retric »

fc417fc802 wrote: post #287
Retric wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

History shows the timeline of dependence here. Before the introduction of cars, “poor road engineering practices” wouldn’t result in those deaths. So clearly it’s cars that are necessitating sidewalks, etc. Same deal here, if something “becomes a problem” because of the introduction of AI, it’s AI that is the root case of the resulting issues. Many people are tempted to argue that flawed humans can’t implement the pe…

Well I (thought it was obvious that) I was referring to roads constructed relatively recently. If cars necessitate sidewalks and the city chooses to cut costs by not putting those in that isn't the fault of automobile designers or manufacturers or dealers or private owners or whoever. To your example, technology changes and that necessitates infrastructure changing. That doesn't mean that fault for mishaps in the mea…

The safest street designs still result in automobile fatalities. You can at best mitigate the issue with better street designs but not address the underlying issue.

Failing to acknowledge cars as the root cause may be comforting, but it blinds you to viable solutions.

Indoor shopping malls for example solve many of the issues with cars by forcing people to move around on foot in a little island surrounded by a sea of very low density parking. They are’t perfect solutions, but they still saved a lot of lives and time.

Saying people are misusing a new technology is just another way of saying that technology is flawed. This doesn’t mean you can’t utilize it, but pretending flaws don’t exist has no value.

Re: Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

#294

Post by [deleted] »

abustamam wrote: post #288
pj_mukh wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea but this feels like when a Waymo ran over a cat, and a Human driver ran over a toddler and both got the same level of coverage in the media (actually the cat got more follow-up coverage). And I'm supposed to believe both issues are equally important. No. That's gaslighting, and totally misplaced political activation.

What do you propose we do in the latter situation? The news isn't the value of the life that was (presumably lost). The news is the circumstances that made that loss possible. Human driver was maybe careless, or maybe didn't look. The child safety classes I took emphasized over and over again to look around your car and yard before backing your car out. This is a problem with a known solution that unfortunately still…

[deleted]

Re: Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

#295

Post by phendrenad2 »

silisili wrote: post #262
phendrenad2 wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many, exactly? Anyone can wave vagueness around. Do you have numbers or no?

I haven't lived there in years, nor do I have exact numbers, but they make national news enough for the same problem nearly every year. I'll drop you some links if you care. 1 - 38 million between 2017 and 2022. 2 - 29 million in 2023. 3 - 12 million in settlements in 2025. Dare I keep going? [1] https://www.wdrb.com/in-depth/louisville-payouts-for-police-... [2] https://www.aol.com/louisville-paid-least-29m-settle-1…

The region's GDP is 100 billion dollars, so these are tiny amounts, although they may seem large to some.

And the first article you link proves that people are already worried about it. You think they can safely 10x that?

Re: Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

#296

Post by silisili »

phendrenad2 wrote: post #295
silisili wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't lived there in years, nor do I have exact numbers, but they make national news enough for the same problem nearly every year. I'll drop you some links if you care. 1 - 38 million between 2017 and 2022. 2 - 29 million in 2023. 3 - 12 million in settlements in 2025. Dare I keep going? [1] https://www.wdrb.com/in-depth/louisville-payouts-for-police-... [2] https://www.aol.com/louisville-paid-least-29m-settle-1…

The region's GDP is 100 billion dollars, so these are tiny amounts, although they may seem large to some. And the first article you link proves that people are already worried about it. You think they can safely 10x that?

> The region's GDP is 100 billion dollars, so these are tiny amounts, although they may seem large to some.

It's a fair point and easy to handwave away "it's only $100 per resident." But it's a lot of money still. And yet that city is shutting down schools and selling off school properties to make budget this year. I bet they'd love to have those wasted millions.

> You think they can safely 10x that?

I have no idea the reason for this question. The OP said cities learn after a couple million dollar suits. I'm showing that no, they do not. If anything suits are increasing.

Re: Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

#297

Post by nbernard »

wvenable wrote: post #260
selcuka wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After a couple million dollar lawsuits the city or state will learn to be more careful with their methods. It's the taxpayer funds, but it's not an endless supply of money. Cities and states have their own budgets.

More than $1.5 billion has been spent to settle claims of police misconduct involving thousands of officers repeatedly accused of wrongdoing. https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/interactive/20...

Good point! It shows that the settlements are far too low and that the victims should get a lot more.

If a few cities/states were to default due to debts coming from such cases, the others would start to take notice...

Re: Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

#298

Post by hacker_mews »

lazy stupid pigs should be accountable for misusing AI like this and calling people into a system like that based on some AI's whim and a facebook peek, but having done no actual investigative work.

Lets see the pig that called for her arrest and wasted 4 months of her life spend 4 months in jail.

Re: Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

#299

Post by rapnie »

pj_mukh wrote: post #119
rglover wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How is this the fault of AI? It flagged a possible match. A live human detective confirmed it. Because we're seeing the first instances of what reality looks like with AI in the hands of the average bear. Just like the excuse was "but the computer said it was correct," now we're just shifting to "but the AI said it was correct." Don't underestimate how much authority and thinking people will delegate to machines. N…

I'm sorry but this is a piss-poor excuse. When I Claude code broken features, I'm responsible 100%. Why are cops not treated the same way? OP is right, AI is totally irrelevant in this story. If the point is "cops can't be trusted". Why do they have GUNS?! AI is the least of your problems. I feel like I'm going crazy with this narrative.

The AI is the authority having so much knowledge, that we hear a reassuring "Please continue" [0].

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment

Re: Innocent woman jailed after being misidentified using AI facial recognition

#300

Post by mschild »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #159
dml2135 wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The “I” in “AI” stands for “intelligence”. Cops are using AI facial recognition because it is being sold to them as being smarter and better than what they are currently capable of. Why are we then surprised that they aren’t second-guessing the technology?

Because they are supposed to possess minimum levels of intelligence found in homo sapiens, which includes not believing anything a salesperson says. Also, their whole job is dealing with people who constantly lie to them.

Some police departments seem to actively reject candidates that have higher scores on IQ tests. Not that I think IQ test scores and actual intelligence are related but it clearly shows their intended target candidate group.

https://abcnews.com/US/court-oks-barring-high-iqs-cops/story...

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