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ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

davidoks.blog

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Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#291
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why will we need 1000 companies tomorrow to do the same thing that 100 companies are doing today? If they are really so efficient because of AI then won't 10 companies be able to solve the same problems?

This is one of the key "inefficiencies" of the private sector - there might be one winner at the end of the day providing the product that fills the market niche, but there was always multiple competitors giving it a go in the mean time. A recent example, Mitchell Hashimoto was pointing out that he wasn't "first to market" with his product(s), he was (at least) SEVENTH

Almost tautologically it's not "inefficient" to do so, because free market economics has decided that all the attempts are mathematically worth it, for a high-margin low-marginal-cost product like software.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would argue we've even already seen this play out with productivity gains across the economy over the last 40 years. The American middle class has been gradually declining since the '80s. AI seems likely to accelerate that trend for the exact reasons you point out. A lot of people recognize this pattern even if they can't articulate it, and that's why they hate AI so much. To them, it doesn't matter if AI lives up…

Technological progress that hurts more people than it helps isn't progress, it's class warfare. We've never seen such a thing before, so I don't know how you can draw such sweeping conclusions about it.

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Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But will it? My prediction is no, because productivity gains must benefit the lower classes to see a multiplier in the economy. For example, ATMs being automated did cause a negative drop in teller jobs, but fast money any time does increase the velocity of money in the economy. It decreases savings rate and encourages spending among the class of people whose money imparts the highest multiplier. AI does not. All t…

> My prediction is no, because productivity gains must benefit the lower classes to see a multiplier in the economy. Baumol's cost disease hurts the lower classes by restricting their access to services like health care and education, and LLMs/agents make it possible to increase productivity in these areas in ways which were once unimaginable. The problem with services is that they're typically resistant to productiv…

Can a robot write a medicine prescription? A medical procedure prescription? If yes, that would be a game-changer. But the medical insurance providers would be very cautious about honoring these. Then, if things go wrong, what entity would be held accountable for malpractice?

You already can get a good-quality medical advice "for nothing", unless it requires e.g. a blood test. The question is, how actionable such an advice is going to be, and how even the quality is going to be.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like someone forgetting that for a large number of people, their mobile device is their only computer.

I know this is true, but for serious tasks, I need the screen real estate. I'm amazed at what some people can do from a phone, but also wonder if they're missing things, of if it's actually inefficient.

What "serious" tasks does banking involve?

I log in to transfer money, to take a photo of a check to deposit it, to check my balance.

All of that is fine on a phone screen. Actually, it's a lot easier to take the check photo.

And a banking app is a whole lot more secure than a browser tab running extensions that might get hijacked, on a desktop OS whose architecture allows this like widespread disk access, keyloggers, etc.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have to grow out of those kind of dreams. That's like a kid dreaming that when he grows up he'll eat ice cream for dinner every day. People when they mature have an innate desire to work. It is good for body and mind. If you're curious about the world, you'll have to do some work one way or another to achieve your goals and satisfy your curiosity. If "society" is just a function of basic needs, then there's plenty…

> People when they mature have an innate desire to work. It is good for body and mind. That doesn't mean it has to be wage labor though.

Completely agree.

But it is usually only people who enjoy work who manage to do something different with their life than wage labour.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going to bet that you are a millennial or older? We need our big screens for $IMPORTANT work (buying big things, money stuff, etc.). GenZ tends to be less bothered by it and just does it all on the tiny screen in their pocket. It's time to schedule a colonoscopy.

My boomer dad does more things on his phone than I do and I'm Gen X. It's actually astonishing how much he does on his iPhone. I'm dragging out the laptop and he's on his iPhone happy as a clam.

I'm a tech loving boomer, I always use my PC for banking, ordering, etc. My wife, however, almost always uses her cell, which is great for when we are traveling. Even though we're only five years apart in age, she's lite years ahead of me with a cell. I freely admit part of my reluctance for using my cell is the mobile tracking ability of companies.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going to bet that you are a millennial or older? We need our big screens for $IMPORTANT work (buying big things, money stuff, etc.). GenZ tends to be less bothered by it and just does it all on the tiny screen in their pocket. It's time to schedule a colonoscopy.

What if millennials are good at both and are choosing the right too for the job?

Phone is probably the best tool for most minor online banking actions.

Not all.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#298
post #35

One key line about ATMs is buried deep in the article: > the number of tellers per branch fell by more than a third between 1988 and 2004, but the number of urban bank branches (also encouraged by a wave of bank deregulation allowing more branches) rose by more than 40 percent So, ATMs did impact bank teller jobs by a significant amount. A third of them were made redundant. It's just that the decrease at individual b…

> So, ATMs did impact bank teller jobs by a significant amount. A third of them were made redundant. It's just that the decrease at individual bank branches was offset by the increase in the total number of branches, because of deregulation and a booming economy and whatever else.

There's an important point here that you're glossing over. The increase in the total number of branches doesn't have to be unrelated to the decrease in the number of tellers each branch requires to operate. The sharp drop in the cost of operating one branch directly means that you can have more branches. This means it isn't true that "a third of bank tellers were made redundant" - some of them were reallocated from existing branches to new ones.

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This and other fairytales. The only solution here is to stop tying people's value to their productivity. That makes a lot of sense in the 1900s but it makes a lot less sense when the primary faucet of productivity is automation. If you insist on tying a person's fundamental right to a decent and secure life to their productivity and then take away their ability to be productive you're left with a permenant and growin…

Who ever said you have the right to a decent a secure life? People don’t universally agree about this. Some of us posit that we will never escape a state of competition for fundamentally scarce resources. And that the organizing principle of a free society should be peaceful coexistence, not mandatory cooperation. You figure out your own economic security, I’ll manage mine.

Oh my, please rant on. I'd love to hear more about people not having the right to a decent and secure life. (After all, I've often thought that having my life tracked and used my a corporation or government would be a wonderful utopia!)

Re: ATMs didn’t kill bank teller jobs, but the iPhone did

#300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because that car repair company with 3 local stores previously couldn't justify building custom software to make their business more efficient and aligned with what they need. The cost was too high. Now they might be able to. Plenty of businesses need very custom software but couldn't realistically build it before.

I see no way that company would save more money from hiring an experienced developer compared to paying their yearly invoice on the COTS product doing the same thing today. The only way this works is with a very wage suppressing effect.

Off the shelf software could still cost thousands per year and I'm sure they don't do everything the shops need them to do.
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