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Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

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Re: Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

#291

Post by avianlyric »

zdragnar wrote: post #274
p0pularopinion wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I generally think both attitudes are a too simplistic look. Basically, the most common pattern with „commodity“ tech seems to be like this. Western companies go ahead and expend a lot of R&D to establish a new market or validate a market need. Chinese companies go ahead and flood the market with slighly worse but significantly cheaper versions of said product (often forcing the „inventor“ company to take a significan…

Western politicians did it to us. China was allowed into the WTO but never held to any of the rules. It is still treated with kid gloves by governments as if it were a developing country despite the fact that it hasn't needed such treatment for decades.

That’s an over simplified view of the world that completely ignores all the benefits of outsourcing our manufacturing to China brought. It may have been short sighted of us, and we may have over valued those short term benefits, over the long term costs, but it wasn’t a decision made by some shadowy group of “politicians”. It was a collective societal decision, to choose easy consumerism, cheap products, and rapid growth in quality of life, over the long term viability of societies.

But this story hasn’t ended yet, and China certainly isn’t treated like a developing country. It’s treated like a country that has a vice grip on our economic nether regions, and we really don’t want to make any sudden unexpected moves.

Re: Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

#292

Post by beepbooptheory »

cs702 wrote: post #254

According to the Financial Times, Roomba has sold more than 40 million robotic devices, most of them robotic vacuum cleaners.[a] Many of those vacuum cleaners have cameras, can move around on their own, and are connected to the Internet. If they're taken offline, they stop working. Many have microphones too. The new Chinese owner will get control of a network of tens of millions Internet-connected, autonomously mobil…

What is the significance to you in just a change of owner here? Relative to the situation already?

Re: Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

#293

Post by Hnrobert42 »

aurareturn wrote: post #260
ksec wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was an interview from a Chinese Founder and he said something that I think accurately sums up the difference. US R&D may be on top in some areas especially AI or Frontier Tech. But it is at best 2x better than China. What sets Chinese companies apart they can have product from Lab to market and manufacturing at scale that is at least an order of magnitude faster than US, not to mention a lot cheaper. Motorola S…

Very unfortunately, they have passed escape velocity and there is no turning back. Unfortunate in what sense? And I am not sure how the West or even the rest of the world can do about it. The last 200-250 years seems to be an abnormal period in which China was not a superpower. Historically, China has always had 25-40% of the world's GDP. It's been so long that many generations have lived and died without seeing Chin…

It is unfortunate given China's abysmal stance on human rights, freedom of information, and pollution.

Re: Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

#294

Post by atwrk »

cs702 wrote: post #254

According to the Financial Times, Roomba has sold more than 40 million robotic devices, most of them robotic vacuum cleaners.[a] Many of those vacuum cleaners have cameras, can move around on their own, and are connected to the Internet. If they're taken offline, they stop working. Many have microphones too. The new Chinese owner will get control of a network of tens of millions Internet-connected, autonomously mobil…

So the actual problem is the "feature" set of the vacuum cleaners, not the nationality of the new owners, right?

Re: Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

#295

Post by meindnoch »

Epskampie wrote: post #227
meindnoch wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you look inside the old battery? It may well be just a bunch of 18650 cells with some electronics in a plastic case. Just desolder the old cells and solder on new ones. I did the same for my wife's cordless vacuum, and it works better than new, because the new cells are about 2x the capacity of the originals.

This is only good advice if you're good at soldering and know details about cells like which ones have in-built protection. Otherwise you're just creating a fire hazard.

>This is only good advice if you're good at soldering

I meant soldering onto the pre-welded tabs that come with the new cell (unless you have a spot welder). You don't need much soldering experience for that.

>and know details about cells like which ones have in-built protection.

It's highly unlikely that the individual cells would be protected ones. Manufacturers are not stupid to pay N times the cost of a management circuit.

Re: Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

#296

Post by mosura »

wccrawford wrote: post #283
vjvjvjvjghv wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems to be a problem with many companies. Chinese companies are innovating aggressively while others don’t. You see that with 3d printers where Bambu is kicking ass. I remember when GoPro did a drone and it simply wasn’t good. Or American carmakers are trying to turn back the clock on electric instead of embracing it.

The funny thing is that Bambu didn't innovate. They just made it work really, really well. I've owned a few 3d printers, including a kit printer, and the Bambu doesn't have any tech that other printers don't. They just always work well, and are easy to maintain. Others are finally catching up, though. Snapmaker really scared them with the U1 (which is getting insane reviews), and Prusa has finally stepped up and star…

> The funny thing is that Bambu didn't innovate. They just made it work really, really well.

Everything wrong with the western tech academic/industrial complex in two sentences.

Re: Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

#297

Post by mkagenius »

kqr wrote: post #289
cs702 wrote: post #254

According to the Financial Times, Roomba has sold more than 40 million robotic devices, most of them robotic vacuum cleaners.[a] Many of those vacuum cleaners have cameras, can move around on their own, and are connected to the Internet. If they're taken offline, they stop working. Many have microphones too. The new Chinese owner will get control of a network of tens of millions Internet-connected, autonomously mobil…

Our household (and I suspect many with us) bought a Roomba specifically to not give the Chinese government a roving camera in our home. Ouch!

Since this can be a significant security issue for the state, why doesn't the government sponsor a security audit of the software. Does it upload the data or everything is done on the device? (Also, will have to keep up with the updates)

Re: Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

#298

Post by bee_rider »

dmantis wrote: post #179
furyg3 wrote: post #136

Are there any good robo-vacuum cleaners that will still clean your floor if the internet is down? I've had my Miele vacuum cleaner for 15 years now, and I bought it second hand. I can still buy bags and filters for it, and when the floor roller piece broke (something heavy fell on it) I was able to buy a replacement one for cheap. I see no reason why it can't go another 10 years. It feels like a very low probability…

For me it's so weird nobody makes a thing you can trust. I would happily overpay 3-4x for the good vacuum without the cloud and the need to do some hacking with valetudo, with an official service and support for the device. Yet nobody is willing to take the money. They'd rather go bankrupt..

Yeah. The real options are usually: a Chinese device from a company that seems nebulously a little close to their government, imported (so, limited need to follow local safety or privacy regulation); or, a US product from a company with explicit connections to the Google/Facebook/Amazon network, and with a warranty that lasts a whole month (as long as you don’t open the battery hatch).

I don’t know if people would pay 3X for something that actually works in their interest, probably not, but it isn’t as if such a product has been tried in the last ~50 years.

Re: Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

#299

Post by jgalt212 »

atwrk wrote: post #294
cs702 wrote: post #254

According to the Financial Times, Roomba has sold more than 40 million robotic devices, most of them robotic vacuum cleaners.[a] Many of those vacuum cleaners have cameras, can move around on their own, and are connected to the Internet. If they're taken offline, they stop working. Many have microphones too. The new Chinese owner will get control of a network of tens of millions Internet-connected, autonomously mobil…

So the actual problem is the "feature" set of the vacuum cleaners, not the nationality of the new owners, right?

Depends on which nations you care about. How would you feel if Roomba devices were controlled by North Korea, for example?

Re: Roomba maker goes bankrupt, Chinese owner emerges

#300

Post by [deleted] »

throw2837374 wrote: post #287
expedition32 wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny that we are running into the same problem that the British had with China in the 19th century: China doesn't need or want anything from the West, they do not trust the West and they certainly do not want to rely on the West. The last time the British came up with the ingenuous opium plan. But that backfired into the communist takeover in 1949.

China loves KFC. There are other American brands that do well such as Nike, The North Face, Coach, Polo, and Estee Lauder. And while Hollywood movies have been in decline in China, Zootopia 2 did amazingly well recently.

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