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Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

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Re: Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

#291
post #34
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ethernet pretty much sucks and has not improved substantially in consumer devices since the previous century. It also has pretty severe idle power consumption consequences for PCs, unless you are an expert who goes around fixing that.

>Ethernet [...] has not improved substantially in consumer devices since the previous century. We've gone from 100 Mbps being standard consumer level to 2.5 or 10 Gbps being standard now. That sounds substantial to me.

They exaggerated a little bit on the timeline. But 20+ years ago 1gbps became standard, and today there are signs of change but 1gbps is still standard.

Re: Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

#292
post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> not as durable Your clearly don’t live in an earthquake prone area. I do. But given how cheapskate New Zealand is, I’m 100% sure that we would build in stone and brick if it was cheaper.

I do live on the west coast of the US. Unreinforced masonry doesn't do well in earthquakes, but reinforced masonry or concrete is probably more durable. I've got 25 year old wood siding, and it might make it to 30, but there's no way it'll be in reasonable shape at 40. It probably won't be too expensive to replace though.

Probably another great example of chasing pennies with pounds. {re,green,pink}bar is really cheap. Yes, it's more expensive but only 10-20% more. It's an upfront cost that that saves you tons of damage, which costs money too! Even more when you put off repair.

It's incredible how people do not understand boot theory... which seems to be something most people know but don't employ in practice

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boots_theory

Re: Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

#293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rental or do you own? If you own, you should replace and/or move them. Might sound scary if you've never done this before but it is much easier than you'd think. If you want to make your future life easier I suggest running a PVC pipe (at minimum in the drop down portion). Replacing or adding new cabling will be much easier if you do this so it's totally worth the few extra bucks and few extra minutes of work. They'l…

> If you want to make your future life easier I suggest running a PVC pipe (at minimum in the drop down portion). Replacing or adding new cabling will be much easier if you do this so it's totally worth the few extra bucks and few extra minutes of work. I’m trying to understand how removing an entire sheet of gypsum (or cutting a 6” by 8’ channel) and installing an empty PVC raceway is ‘a few extra minutes of work’.…

  > I’m trying to understand how removing an entire sheet of gypsum
This is a fixed task. Required if you install the conduit or not. You have to cut the wall to make the port. If you have the port you can just use a slightly longer conduit, brace it where you can reach, and oh no you need an extra 2" of cable?

  > Raceways are unnecessary in stick built houses
 
Your mental model is too naïve. Have you done this before? Have you then replaced it or added additional lines?

The conduit makes all that easier, and provides the additional protection that I discussed. By having a conduit you're far less likely to get snagged on something while fishing the lines. You can stop hard corners that strip your cables while pulling on them. It's also a million times easier to see while you're chasing those cables. Sure, your house is a framing with wood but you still have insulation and who likes icy hands?

Really, think about it. What is the cost now compared to the future?

Is an additional 10 or let's even say a crazy 50% additional work now really that costly when you have to do the whole thing again in the future? And multiple times? It's a no brainier lol. Definition of chasing pennies with pounds. Just be nice to your future self. Be lazy long term, not lazy short term because lazy short term requires more work

Re: Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

#294
post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot has changed in the 25 years since gbit wired ethernet was rolled out. While wired ethernet stagnated due to greed. Got powerlines? Well then you can get gbit+ to a few outlets in your house. Got old CATV cables? Then you can use them at multiple gbit with MoCA. Got old phone lines? Then its possible to run ethernet over them with SPE and maybe get a gbit. And frankly just calling someone who wires houses and ge…

> Got old phone lines? Then its possible to run ethernet over them with SPE and maybe get a gbit. Depending on the age of the house, there's a chance that phone lines are 4-pair, and you can probably run 1G on 4-pair wire, it's probably at least cat3 if it's 4-pair and quality cat3 that's not a max length run in dense conduit is likely to do gigE just fine. If it's only two-pair, you can still run 100, but you'll wan…

Can confirm on the gigabit because I've got my gigabit internet running over old phone line right now. I'm not sure exactly how long the run is, but it goes to this floor's electrical room where the ONT is housed into a closet in my apartment where it's then spliced into CAT-5 to reach the router. I really didn't expect it to work but speed tests report that I'm getting 900+ Mbps.

Re: Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

#295
One of the things that makes our wifi suck are HP (and other) printers using wifi direct. Looking at a wifi scan, I can see new fewer than 5 of my neighbors printers screaming to the top of their lungs.

The only thing that makes wifi in a large condo building viable is the 6Ghz channels available on wifi 6e

Re: Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

#296
post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's sounds like a good concept: I'm no stranger to cheap IoT devices chewing up local 2.4GHz bandwidth with chatter and I have a lot of that going on. But does it matter in 2025? As a broad concept: Ever since my last Sonos device [that they didn't deliberately brick] died, I don't have any even vaguely bandwidth-intensive devices left in my world that are 2.4GHz-only. Whatever laptop I have this year prefers the…

You are lucky. In 2025 I have to run most of my 20-30 wifi devices on 2.4 GHz because 5 GHz won't penetrate the walls in my house, especially diagonally. My dev laptop is about 10 m (30 ft) away from the wifi access point, but goes through about 6 walls diagonally, due to some weird layout, and 2.4 GHz is way faster. The house has some thick walls. Same with phones. As soon as I'm in a different room, 2.4 GHz is fast…

I've lived in houses like that.

My last house, which was rather small (by midwestern American standards, anyway) had some interior walls that were very good at blocking 5GHz transmissions. (I never took them apart to look, but I suspect that some of them had plaster with metal lath as one or more layers.)

I started with one access point downstairs at the front (because that's where the cable modem lived) but it didn't work so well upstairs, at the back (diagonally) in the room I was using as an office.

So I added another access point upstairs at the back and that fixed it: Wifi became solid-enough both upstairs and down, and also covered the entire back yard, and also worked great for the neighbors when they asked if they could borrow a cup of Internet. It took some literal gymnastics in some very weird normally-unseen spaces to accomplish that run, but it got done. :)

As an side: It's interesting that being blocked by walls is also part of what makes 5GHz wifi so speedy indoors (in addition to having a lot more spectrum to use), for many [not all] people. By being attenuated so well by walls, the co-channel interference from the neighbors is reduced rather dramatically. With neighbors nearby, the RF environment tends to be a lot quieter at 2.4GHz than at 5GHz.

---

Present-day house is a bit lucky: All of the thirsty tech is on the first floor, and it's very simple to get ethernet cables routed 'round in the basement (it's all utility space). I was able to find enough pre-existing holes in the floor (from old cable TV installs and also floor-mounted outlets that have been removed and covered) that getting ethernet to every useful area of every first-floor room with tech in it was a very simple ordeal that did not require a drill. (Yeah, that means that there's a wire poking up through the floor behind the desk I'm sitting at right now instead of a tidy RJ45 receptacle on a wall plate with a nice port designation label. I'm over it; it works perfectly and inertia is a hell of a drug.)

But I'm not completely "lucky." The present house has aluminum siding and low-E windows. It's a great house that is amazingly inexpensive to heat and cool for how old it is, but it has aluminum siding and low-E windows and approximates a somewhat-leaky Faraday cage.

Thus, my cell phone barely works indoors, but it works great outside. And wifi barely works outside on the porch (front or back, doesn't matter), and really not at all beyond the porch (but things like my phone think that it should work, which is problematic).

I worked around that well-enough for the detached garage and back yard area by adding another access point in the garage, configured as a wireless repeater. Its advantage is that it has antennas that are optimized to work well, instead of some that are optimized to be very small (like those inside my phone, or my laptop). It's identical to the one inside the house and gets OK signal to/from the main AP, which it has a visual line-of-sight to through a couple of windows.

As an impromptu solution made from stuff I already had leftover from the last place, it works. I'm not winning any speed records with that remote access point... but it seems to be reliable, and reliability is good.

(Maybe some day I'll actually get around to upgrading the electricity to the garage to support some easy-to-access rooftop solar and/or car charging and/or welding and/or something, and when that trenching happens I'll also drop in some single-mode fiber. A single run of pre-terminated fiber is very cheap to buy, the "optics" at the endpoints are very inexpensive, and it is very safe with its essentially-absolute electrical isolation. It feels like overkill, but it's also once and done.)

Re: Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

#297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The other bit of advice that is buried in there that no-one wants to hear for residences is the best way to speed up your Wi-Fi is to not use it. You might think it's convenient to have your TV connect to Netflix via WiFi and it is, but it is going to make everything else that really needs the Wi-Fi slower. It's a much better answer to hook up everything on Ethernet that you possibly can than it is to follow the mo…

The house I live in was built with ethernet, but of the fourteen outlets the builders saw fit to include, not one is located where we can make use of it. The two devices in our house which use a wired connection are both plugged directly into the switch in our utility closet. (We do have one internet-connected device which permanently lives about an inch away from one of the ethernet sockets, but it is, ironically, a…

You know about Ethernet over power lines right?

Re: Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

#298
post #289
post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't know how 2025 houses are built but I would be surprised if they didn't have an ethernet jack in every room to a wiring closet of some sort. Not sure about coax. Aye. Cat5/6/whatever-ish cabling has been both the present and the future for something on the order of 25 years now. It's as much of a no-brainer to build network wiring into a home today as it once was to build telephone and TV wiring into a home.…

Sheesh. I would expect a high end house to have ceiling mount ethernet jacks for fancy APs in most rooms. At least family room(s) and bedrooms. Very much not worth it to retrofit later in a multistory building, but would be super handy.

Yeah, that first meeting with the other contractors was like walking into bizarro-world.

They (the homeowner) were getting dedicated custom-built single-purpose wall-mounted shelving for each of these Eeros devices, along with dedicated 120V outlets for each of them to provide power.

Now they're still getting that, plus the Ethernet jack that I will be installing on the wall at these locations because that's the extent to which I am empowered to inject sanity.

(Maybe someone down the road will look at it and go "Yeah, that just needs to be a wall-mounted access point with PoE," and remove even more stupid from the things.

Or... not: People are unpredictable and it seems like many home buyers' first task is to rip out and erase as much current-millennia technology as possible, reducing the home to bare walls under a roof, with a kitchen, a shitter, and some light switches and HVAC.)

Re: Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

#299
post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are times I do envy people living in stick houses with hollow walls.

I live in a brick house where only half of the walls are hollow. Bringing Ethernet wires to a few critical areas and putting small surface-mount RJ-45 sockets was not that hard. Of course, some thin raceways can be seen somewhere along the baseboard. It does not look terrible, and is barely noticeable.

there are baseboards with build in raceways. installing some right now

Re: Does our “need for speed” make our wi-fi suck?

#300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve used Ethernet over coax in my current apartment. It’s worked well! You do need to be a bit careful as coax signal can be shared with neighbors and others sometimes.

You can isolate your ethernet over coax from your neighbor with a MoCA POE "point of entry" filter which blocks the frequencies used by MoCA. You can buy them online for around $10 and they install without tools, Besides neighbors, you may also need a POE filter if you have certain types of cable modem.

cable companies require poe filters. if they find that there is some "noise" leaking from your house, they may put a big filter of their own outside, that can degrade speed of modem
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