Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The End of Handwriting

wired.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

291–300 of 338 posts

Re: The End of Handwriting

#291

Post by ACCount37 »

bayindirh wrote: post #275
ACCount37 wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Writing imposes a speed barrier to brain" sounds like a bad thing, period. It's not like you can't impose a speed barrier at will. Plenty of writers or programmers spend time thinking, writing absolutely nothing - regardless of whether they use a mechanical keyboard or a goose feather quill. Humans aren't LLMs - nothing compels them to produce text at all times. Plenty of writers and programmers also spend a lot of…

Sorry, I don't know how to put it more politely, because I ran out of words. You sound like someone who refuses to believe that vitamins are healthy for the body, because the pills smell funny. What you said is true though. I also spend some time not writing or typing anything but thinking, but I know where I want to arrive and trying to find a polite and concise path from where I am to the point I'm trying to arrive…

You sound like someone who says "vegetables are natural and healthy and humans ate vegetables since time immemorial and everyone should eat this" and then points to a fucking tomato. Which wasn't even a part of human diet in most of the world until ~4 centuries ago. This is the kind of thing handwriting is.

Really, it just sounds like you like tomatoes way too much. Which is fine. But don't you go around preaching about how tomatoes are a vital part of human diet and everyone should eat them all the time.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#292

Post by pier25 »

elric wrote: post #173
noosphr wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cursive as taught in schools today is useless at best and dangerous for your health at worst. The cursive that made the world run between 1850 and 1925 was called business penmanship and it lets you write at 40 words per minute for 14 hours every day for decades on end without pain or injury. If you're interested here's the best book about it: https://archive.org/details/tamblyns-home-instructor-in-penm... Note the a…

Looking at this book, it seems very similar to how I was taught in the late 80s early 90s. We were forced to use fountain pens, and would get berated if we got ink on our hands. I'm not sure if I can tell the difference between Tamblyn's business penmanship" and "looped cursive" and any other type of cursive to be honest. The difference in individual handwriting seems to be much larger than the difference in overarch…

I attended French school (I'm not French) and up until high school I was forced to use fountain pens too.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#293

Post by UltraSane »

IAmBroom wrote: post #191
UltraSane wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reminds me of all the many hours I spent being forced to do long division of 3 digit numbers into 5 and 6 digit numbers. What a waste of time.

Not predicting the computer revolution, and specifically the calculator revolution, is not their fault. It's like complaining that you were taught how to ride a horse, but it's 1921 now and NOBODY in New York City rides horses!!! I absolutely have done long division, when a calc wasn't handy - back when that was possible.

This was in the 1990s so calculators were common. I was born at the worst time for math education, when calculators and Computer Algebra Systems were becoming common but math education hadn't adapted yet.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#294

Post by lotsoweiners »

hinkley wrote: post #268
noosphr wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cursive as taught in schools today is useless at best and dangerous for your health at worst. The cursive that made the world run between 1850 and 1925 was called business penmanship and it lets you write at 40 words per minute for 14 hours every day for decades on end without pain or injury. If you're interested here's the best book about it: https://archive.org/details/tamblyns-home-instructor-in-penm... Note the a…

Do they still teach cursive in school? I’m pretty sure I know a handful of college kids who never learned it.

My children go to a charter school in AZ and they are only allowed to write in cursive (3rd grade and on). Public school families I have talked to are also learning cursive.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#295

Post by noosphr »

Exoristos wrote: post #239
noosphr wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cursive as taught in schools today is useless at best and dangerous for your health at worst. The cursive that made the world run between 1850 and 1925 was called business penmanship and it lets you write at 40 words per minute for 14 hours every day for decades on end without pain or injury. If you're interested here's the best book about it: https://archive.org/details/tamblyns-home-instructor-in-penm... Note the a…

This book is quite a find. I'm tempted to give it a go, as it could make my writing portable anywhere. My only misgiving is later getting that writing into electronic form, which nowadays is a non-negotiable. The technology for handwriting recognition, long-form, seems to still be fairly poor.

I'm starting to appreciate not having digitised notes.

When you can sit down and write out 1,000 words in 30 minites making indexes which you update weekly becomes just another form of revision. This works well for both study and business planning. Less so for emails and instant messages, but each medium for its intended purpose.

It is amazing how much of our education system requires being able to write text by the wheelbarrow when no one today can write more than a thimbleful without hand cramps and wrist pain. Imagine how much people would want to use Facebook or reddit if every like and upvote came with an electric shock. Our education system does that to everyone from age 8 and up when it comes to writing anything down.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#296

Post by teeray »

b112 wrote: post #99
everettp wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

that may be the case for your particular writing style, but it is not universal. i have a mild orthopaedic problem, and i found, in my twenties after years of struggling with disposable pens, that a fountain pen allowed me to write more lightly and fluidly on the page with the result that my words per minute more than doubled. my writing is still ugly, but it is vastly faster and a bit more legible. fountain pens are…

I envision electrically charged ink, and opposing paper, so one only need approach the page with implement, and the ink flies upon it.

Just need a clothing iron as a fuser and you’ve got yourself an artisanal copy machine.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#297

Post by dranudin »

siva7 wrote: post #279
dranudin wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me, in Germany, it was always cursive from the beginning to the end of school. We learned to write in the first class of elementary school. I still only write cursive and cannot write any other style, by hand. And only with a fountain pen. The style I was taught is called "Lateinische Ausgangsschrift". At a catholic elementary school in NRW. If you are interested here is an overview of the different cursive style…

I'm now really confused. I've also been taught this type in german elementary school. But since after school cursive was thought of as children / school handwriting and not something adults should use in professional settings. Also the use of fountain pents was considered childish.

Well, I was never taught otherwise. However lots of the other kids later in high school had developed another way of writing. So me writing cursive, now, as a grown man, is a little strange. I still write with the fountain pen, because it is much nicer to write. You need almost no pressure and that is good for your fingers, if you need to write for a longer time.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#298

Post by dranudin »

IAmBroom wrote: post #230
dranudin wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me, in Germany, it was always cursive from the beginning to the end of school. We learned to write in the first class of elementary school. I still only write cursive and cannot write any other style, by hand. And only with a fountain pen. The style I was taught is called "Lateinische Ausgangsschrift". At a catholic elementary school in NRW. If you are interested here is an overview of the different cursive style…

Fascinating! So, you weren't ever taught to print?

No never. They taught us some type of preletters in cursive, in kindergarden, as a stepping stone to real cursive. We never wrote print in elementary school. However, the kindergarden and elementary school were catholic institutions. Most probably they are more conservative than the average in the country.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#299

Post by 4gotunameagain »

1718627440 wrote: post #200
4gotunameagain wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a false equivalence. One is a tedious and deprecated way of writing, the other is a complete dependence in technology. Imagine if the power goes down. The kids won't be able to write anymore.

A typewriter wouldn't need power.

Okay great. One in 10.000 that has a typewriter will be able to write.

Re: The End of Handwriting

#300

Post by jamiek88 »

hinkley wrote: post #269
taeric wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't remember being punished for bad handwriting, but I know I got chided for it a lot. And I know we spent a lot of time on it. It definitely sucked, at every level of the experience. I also find it odd that people have some off assertions on why we learn cursive. I'm sure there is a multitude of reasons, but I find it hard to think it has any strong advantage over other ways. I do get a kick out of my kids being…

Disrespect from an authority figure is punishment unless you’re a sociopath.

You said it in a more challenging way than I would but yeah I thought as i read that comment ‘it sure felt like punishment to me’ as I had similar public ‘chiding’ over my inability to improve my handwriting like it was some moral failure.
Post reply on HN