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Diet, not lack of exercise, drives obesity, a new study finds

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Re: Diet, not lack of exercise, drives obesity, a new study finds

#291

Post by 6510 »

Der_Einzige wrote: post #252
stouset wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> anyone who has done extensive 'athletic' physical activity knows that if you don't up your calorie intake that you will lose weight. Anyone who has done extensive athletic physical activity knows that you will up your calorie intake unless you take explicit and intentional effort not to.

[flagged]

I just got a rather heavy physical job. Every shift is humbling. :P

I see a personal trainer on youtube one time who summarized all the components of weight loss so wonderfully I cant help but feel I butcher the topic whenever I talk about it.

The number one thing is sleeping. Go though the carnival of things people try to get their sleep sorted out.

The second thing is stress of both kinds. You need to be able to calm the fuck down. The body stores as much as possible in survival mode.

Then comes food. Your body need to adjust to burning fat for energy. People do this with tiny fasts and keto but (my entirely untested theory) is that you should fast for as long as it feels comfortable (no stress) then break the fast with keto. You start with something small, wait a bit then can eat quite a lot as long as there is no sugar and no carbs on the plate (keto). Then you do the next fast for as long as you can comfortably do. If you feel like complete shit eat some potatoes or even sugar and get back to the routine. Switching from carbs to fat cold turkey creates unwanted stress.

Then (if you didn't already) start mixing in a small amount of moderate physical activity. Walking for an hour per day is the goal. Keep an eye on what feels comfortable. Stay in the comfort zone. You may have to shorten the fast or eat a bit more between the fasts.

You don't have to go there but there are people who regularly fast for weeks and only have some cravings the first 1-2 days. They are obviously losing weight when they do that.

There are people who add [mild] strength training, will eat more and gain muscle weight. The good kind of weight.

If you add cardio you will also eat more but (like you said) you will feel like shit almost instantly after eating shit. From my experience I think it might actually kill you if you drain your reserves and try to replenish it with bullshit, say deep fried mars bars. You will be less capable fighting of diseases, infections or injuries when completely drained. You will quickly accumulate all the right stomach bacteria to create cravings for all the right things to eat.

Whatever you chose to do, it isn't about what you can do and accomplish today. It has to be a routine that will last 10-20 years. If you go from extensive athletic physical activity to sitting on the sofa for a few months the athletic digestive system is still there.

There was a fun study where they looked at big eaters both skinny and fat. Both ate just about everything but the skinny ones ate a lot more fat and the fat ones ate a lot more carbs. It seems to suggest that for the really lazy fat people an extra bucket of chicken to avoid eating a pizza might be worth a shot. More butter and more eggs per slice of bread. Two steaks and 1/3 the potatoes. etc

I'm not saying it will work but it would be fascinating if it did.

Re: Diet, not lack of exercise, drives obesity, a new study finds

#292

Post by tonymet »

znpy wrote: post #275
tonymet wrote: post #155

For most people, a 1 hour moderate run is only about 1-2 cookies worth (and only half a Crumbl cookie). Even a marathon run might only burn 2000 calories . a chipotle burrito is 1600 . In other words, for 95% of people doing activity, they shouldn't eat any surplus if their goal is to maintain or lose weight. It's actually best to do most of your activity undernourished, as it helps develop true intuitive nutrition f…

+1 for undernourishment. Discovered that as a broken uni student, and has become my goto fix to lose weight. Lost 10-11kgs over the last year by means of that. The occasional “cheat” (mostly social events really) slows the process down but don’t really stop it. It’s not really a fast process though… but it strongly depends on how under nourished you are and how active you are. For me keeping myself between 8000 and 1…

That’s great progress. It comes down to inverting the normal indulgence cycle. Once you discover that under-eating can feel better than over eating – you feel immensely better.

Re: Diet, not lack of exercise, drives obesity, a new study finds

#293

Post by hermitcrab »

cthalupa wrote: post #287
hermitcrab wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that the research shows that a highly active hunter gathering and an inactive office worker burn roughly the same number of calories per day. But I find that hard to believe. What is the office worker's body doing to make up the difference for all the movement and muscle contraction?

Lots and lots (and lots) of small subconscious movements throughout the day. Many thousands of them. Moving your heard around, tilting it a bit, wiggling your toes, rolling your shoulders, scratching an itch, etc. Anecdotally, I believe I have a personal example of the sort of thing that changes. I went from being ultra-sedentary to exercising 5+ days a week over the past year. My body had enough of these tics that t…

Glad to hear that exercize has worked for you.

>Add up enough of all these tiny things over the course of a day, things you probably don't even realize you're doing, and each tiny fraction of a calorie expended eventually pushes you to the levels you see with more regular exercise.

Fidgeting will obviously burn some calories. But I find it hard to believe that fidgeting will burn the same amount of calories as sustained exersize.

I have heard some suggestion that the extra energy is being burned at a cellular level (causing inflammation). But would be office work get hot if that was the case?

Re: Diet, not lack of exercise, drives obesity, a new study finds

#294

Post by aeonik »

bko wrote: post #78
baseballdork wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That wasn't my takeaway from that comment. > Your body adjusts its metabolism based on the amount of food you eat as long as it's not chronic. Suggests that your metabolism is changing, as though your body becomes more or less efficient at burning calories because you're eating more or less. Instead, these guys eat a huge surplus of calories and then go into a deficit to get back to their standard weight.

Sure he cuts back his calories, but 70 hotdogs is about 21k calories. I don't think he goes into a 21k calorie deficit over the next few weeks. That's an insane deficit. That would be the equivalent of not eating for 8.5 days, which is not possible since it would mess with his training. He probably cuts it back some fraction of that, say 10k and his body's increased metabolism adjusts for the rest.

Your body is not converting all 21k calories to fat in an event like that. There are many physiological limits to caloric conversion to fat.

I'm not exactly sure what their bodies are doing, but I guarantee you my body would get rid of that food extremely quickly before it was fully digested.

Re: Diet, not lack of exercise, drives obesity, a new study finds

#295

Post by goosedragons »

Der_Einzige wrote: post #252
stouset wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> anyone who has done extensive 'athletic' physical activity knows that if you don't up your calorie intake that you will lose weight. Anyone who has done extensive athletic physical activity knows that you will up your calorie intake unless you take explicit and intentional effort not to.

[flagged]

Also former fat guy here. I absolutely have not had that experience. I have easily maintained being fat (or even gained) while running 15-20k a week and walking everywhere. It's only when I actively moderate my eating have I lost weight. Otherwise I'd just slam down Oreos or whatever. It's stupid easy to get unfilling high calorie food.

It's good that it worked for you, but it clearly doesn't work for everyone.

Re: Diet, not lack of exercise, drives obesity, a new study finds

#296

Post by michaelhoney »

milesvp wrote: post #144
swat535 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The sample dataset explicitly excluded 'athletes', so would exclude people that _are_ outrunning a bad diet. You can't outrun a bad diet. This is such a myth and I have no idea where it's coming from. Perhaps it's a nice lie one can tell himself to continue eating junk and not feel guilty about it. Athletes, especially body builders require a lot of calories but their diet is surprisingly healthy. They eat plenty o…

I once worked a night shift stocking job just after college. I was in phenomenal shape without hitting the gym. I was at my lowest weight with a ton of lean muscle as a result of moving heavy loads and stocking paint every night. I also did the math at one point, and given the size of the warehouse I was probably walking quickly 8 miles during my shift. It became a chore to eat enough calories every day. Somewhere ar…

You make a good point about the time investment. You were able to do your exercise while working, but very few people will spend 16-24 hours a week working out.

Re: Diet, not lack of exercise, drives obesity, a new study finds

#298

Post by mathgeek »

red-iron-pine wrote: post #256
paulddraper wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely. This is one reason bodybuilders (the closest thing to professional dieters) will only do low intensity cardio -- walking etc -- when cutting weight. High intensity cardio burns calories but increases appetite disproportionately. Albeit otherwise excellent for overall health.

literally get on a tredmill, angle it, and walk for an hour or two

Can you clarify what your goal and outcomes are for that?

Re: Diet, not lack of exercise, drives obesity, a new study finds

#299

Post by yoz-y »

com2kid wrote: post #7

This is true to an extent and I'm very fond of the saying, but beyond a certain point you can indeed outrun a bad diet. I used to spend ~4 hours a day training martial arts (kickboxing, BJJ, etc) during which time I could eat almost anything I wanted without gaining weight. I'm sure if I had downed a cheesecake a day it would've been bad for me, but I was able to get away with a level of excess back then that I am un…

So you can indeed outrun a bad diet, it just takes more running than most people w̶a̶n̶t̶ have time to to do!

Re: Diet, not lack of exercise, drives obesity, a new study finds

#300

Post by paulddraper »

Der_Einzige wrote: post #255
paulddraper wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely. This is one reason bodybuilders (the closest thing to professional dieters) will only do low intensity cardio -- walking etc -- when cutting weight. High intensity cardio burns calories but increases appetite disproportionately. Albeit otherwise excellent for overall health.

I hate /fit/ and the bodybuilding forums so much. Stupid memes like this, SS, GOMAD, and related exist and continue to be parroted because of them. No, using a segway to move in between weight machines will not preserve your gains. The amount of mental gymnastics performed by these guys to justify hilariously stupid physical decisions is simply colossal. I applaud folks like Chloe Ting (a "cardio bunny" aesthetic you…

Does she keep up with them on their lifts?
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