Earlier quoted context omitted.
Google doesn’t have to change search. It already returns AI generated crap before anything useful.
Append -ai to your query to omit AI results.
I appended changing my search engine
Nobody knows how to build with AI yet
291–300 of 432 posts
Re: Nobody knows how to build with AI yet
#292Earlier quoted context omitted.
Serious question: have you considered that dealing with all that minutiae and working through all that pain has made you capable to have the LLM write code? Those young engineers, in 10 years, won't be able to fix what the LLM gave them,because they have not learned anything about programming. They have all learned how to.micromanage an LLM instead.
> Those young engineers, in 10 years, won't be able to fix what the LLM gave them,because they have not learned anything about programming. I have heard a version of this plenty of times, and it was never correct. In the early 90s it was the "electronics" people that were saying "I come from an electronics background, these young'uns will look at a computer and don't know what to do if it breaks". Well, bob, we did,…
Have you also heard about calculators?
Every single finance person uses a calculator. How effective do you think a person in any aspect of finance would be if they had never learned what multiplication is? Would they perform their job adequately if they don't know that `X * Y` is `X repeated Y times`?
IOW, if you gave a finance person (accountant, asset manager, whatever) a non-deterministic calculator for multiplication, would you trust the person's output if they never learned what multiplication is?
This is the situation I am asking about; we aren't talking about whether deterministically automating something that the user already knows how to do is valuable, we're talking about whether non-deterministically generating something that the user is unable to do themselves, even if given all the time in the world, is valuable.
All those examples you give are examples of deterministic automation that the user could inspect for accuracy. I'm asking about a near-future where people managing your money have never learned multiplication because "Multiplication has been abstracted away to a tool that gets it right 90% of the time"
Re: Nobody knows how to build with AI yet
#293Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have systemic concerns with how Google is changing roles from "knowledge bridging" to "knowledge translating", but in terms of information: I find it very useful. You find it gives you poor information?
Always check the sources. I've personally found it; - Using a source to claim the opposite of what the source says. - Point to irrelevant sources. - Use a very untrustworthy source. - Give our sources that do not have anything to do with what it says. - Make up additional things like any other LLM without source or internet search capability, despite reading sources. I've specifically found Gemeni (the one Google put…
> - Using a source to claim the opposite of what the source says.
That's because a lot of people do that all the time when arguing online. Cite something without bothering to read it.
Re: Nobody knows how to build with AI yet
#294My theory on AI is it's the next iteration of google search, a better more conversational, base layer over all the information that exists on the internet. Of course some people will lose jobs just like what happened to several industries when search became ubiquitous. (newspapers, phone books, encyclopedias, travel agents) But IMHO this isn't the existential crisis people think it is. It's just a tool. Smart, clever…
Yeah; there's still a massive chasm between "I spent hours precisely defining my requirements for this greenfield application with no users and the AI one-shot it" and "million line twenty team enterprise SaaS hellscale with ninety-seven stakeholders per line of code". The fact that AI can actually handle the former case is, to be clear, awesome; but not surprising. Low-code tools have been doing it for years. Retool…
> Dario Amodei says we'll have the first billion dollar solo-company by 2026 [1]. I lean toward this not happening.
Why not? Not like companies have to actually do anything beyond marketing to get insane evaluations… remember theranos?
Re: Nobody knows how to build with AI yet
#295Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Those young engineers, in 10 years, won't be able to fix what the LLM gave them,because they have not learned anything about programming. I have heard a version of this plenty of times, and it was never correct. In the early 90s it was the "electronics" people that were saying "I come from an electronics background, these young'uns will look at a computer and don't know what to do if it breaks". Well, bob, we did,…
Have you also heard about calculators? Every single finance person uses a calculator. How effective do you think a person in any aspect of finance would be if they had never learned what multiplication is? Would they perform their job adequately if they don't know that `X * Y` is `X repeated Y times`? IOW, if you gave a finance person (accountant, asset manager, whatever) a non-deterministic calculator for multiplica…
> Have you also heard about calculators?
Yup, my mom used to say "you need to be able to do it without a calculator, because in life you won't always have a calculator with you"... Well, guess what mom :)
But on a serious note, what I'm trying to say (perhaps poorly worded) is that this is a typical thing older generations say about younger ones. They'll be lost without x and y. They won't be able to do x because they haven't learned about y. They need to go through the tough stuff we went through, otherwise they'll be spoiled brats.
And that's always been wrong, on many levels. The younger generations always made it work. Just like we did. And just like the ones before us did.
There's this thing that parents often do, trying to prepare their children for the things they think will be relevant, from the parent's perspective. And that often backfires, because uhhh the times are achanging. Or something. You get what I'm trying to say. It's a fallacy to presuppose that you know what's coming, or that somehow an entire generation won't figure things out if they have a shortcut to x and y. They'll be fine. We're talking about millions / billions of people eventually. They'll figure it out.
Re: Nobody knows how to build with AI yet
#296"I'd wander into my office, check what Claude had built, test it real quick. If it worked, great! Commit and push." Man, I'm going to make so much money as a Cybersecurity Consultant!
Potentially. But also remember what they say about self-driving cars, that it'd make fewer and fewer mistakes than a real driver.
Yeah, when I'm building side projects that sometimes have more traction than anticipated I build them taking many shortcuts.
I've found LLM's add lots of standard protections to api endponts, or database constraints etc than I would do on a lazy Saturday.
Re: Nobody knows how to build with AI yet
#297I'm loving the new programming. I don't know where it goes either, but I like it for now. I'm actually producing code right this moment, where I would normally just relax and do something else. Instead, I'm relaxing and coding. It's great for a senior guy who has been in the business for a long time. Most of my edits nowadays are tedious. If I look at the code and decide I used the wrong pattern originally, I have to…
> What junior devs will do, I'm not so sure. They somehow have to jump to the top of the mountain, but the stairs are gone. Exactly my thinking, nearly 50, more than 30 years of experience in early every kind of programming, like you do, I can easily architect/control/adjust the agent to help me produce great code with a very robust architecture. By I do that out of my experience, both in modelling (science) and prog…
I don’t know how seniors will cope. You seem to have a solid understanding that you can make use of AI. But most seniors on HN struggle with basic tasks using AI. Juniors are likely to out pace them quickly. But potentially without the experience or understanding.
Re: Nobody knows how to build with AI yet
#298Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is the same generation that falls for online scams more than their grandparents do[1]. [1] https://www.vox.com/technology/23882304/gen-z-vs-boomers-sca...
It may be the same generation, but it's probably not the same people.
I think the argument is that growing up with something doesn't necessarily make you good at it. I think it rings especially true with higher level abstractions. The upcoming generation is bad with tech because tech has become more abstract, more of a product and less something to tinker with and learn about. Tech just works now and requires little in assistance from the user, so little is learned.
Re: Nobody knows how to build with AI yet
#299Earlier quoted context omitted.
I also am enjoying LLMs, but I get no joy out of just prompting them again and again. I get so incredibly bored, with a little side of anxiety that I don’t really know how my program works. I’ll probably get over it, but I’ve been realizing how much fun I get out building something as opposed to just having be built . I used to think all I cared about was results, and now I know that’s not true, so that’s fun! Of cou…
I've always felt building something was close to artistry. You create something out of your thoughts, you shape it how you want and you understand how it works to the most minute detail. The amount of times I've shown something seemingly simple to someone and went "but wait this is what is actually happening in the background!" and started explaining something I thought was cool or clever are great memories to me. AI…
> There's no pride, no joy, just productivity.
This is exactly what bothers me about the present moment. Not that the pride of craftsmanship is everything, but dialing it down to zero with extreme pressure to stay that way is a bit sad.
But we’ve clearly gone through this with other mediums before, perhaps someday people will appreciate hand written code the way we appreciate hand carved wood. Or perhaps we were all wasting time in this weird middle ground in the march of progress. I guess we’ll find out in 5-15 years.
Re: Nobody knows how to build with AI yet
#300I’m feeling limited by the tools right now. The software for using LLMs is an incongruent mess. For example, how can I have a global system prompt shared across all the apps I use my OpenRouter key with? I can’t, I have to set it in each application. How can I carry a conversation over from one app to another? How can I give all my apps access to the same set of MCP tools? Most of the apps I use don’t even properly s…
I have this small project that lets you use Claude code (because their terminal UI is really smart) with any OpenRouter model: https://github.com/terhechte/CCORP Works fine on macOS / Linux, untested on Windows. Still working on improving it.
Thanks, interested in trying this.