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Amazon's Vulcan Robots Now Stow Items Faster Than Humans

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Re: Amazon's Vulcan Robots Now Stow Items Faster Than Humans

#291

Post by ge96 »

olelele wrote: post #278
ge96 wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It just made it more fun. There was a liquor store nearby so drive to it on the 30 minute break, pound a couple 100 proof 100ml bottles (99 Apples), back to it. That job was more fun than stow. If you're curious can read the subreddit /r/amazonfc They did recently start allowing you to buy their own approved headphones but before you'd get written up for being on your phone/having headphones in

I’m always amazed at how easily ppl admit to drinking and driving..

We would drink in the parking lot before walking into work

Then 3 hrs later the buzz is gone by next break

I have an amazon shrine haha to remember

https://i.imgur.com/VogGYmw.png

Re: Amazon's Vulcan Robots Now Stow Items Faster Than Humans

#292

Post by immibis »

vlovich123 wrote: post #284
burnerthrow008 wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> while the court held that the board had to prioritize shareholder profits It's a bit more nuanced than that. The court held that company directors have to be acting for the benefit of shareholders. They still have wide latitude about how to do that. The reason Ford lost is because his legal position was essentially "I am king, therefore I can do whatever I want". But you can't do whatever you want. You can't lock t…

“Paying people more money makes them more efficient, motivated, and productive which benefits the company more than it costs. The expansion investment is to grow even faster to bring even more profits over the long term”. Done. I doubt Henry Ford had trouble coming up with a fig leaf explanation if that’s all that was truly needed.

A parent comment hypothesizes that Ford, being a ruthless capitalist, literally couldn't think of that.

Re: Amazon's Vulcan Robots Now Stow Items Faster Than Humans

#293

Post by sph »

krapp wrote: post #126
sph wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're moving towards a future where the entire earth and asteroid belt are mined by machines to build more machines.

No we aren't, not even a little.

The day it happens you won’t have much time to say “damn, you were right” before you are atomised and reconstituted as an Amazon Prime cardboard package.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_goo

Re: Amazon's Vulcan Robots Now Stow Items Faster Than Humans

#294

Post by immibis »

reverius42 wrote: post #27
krapp wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Robots aren't inexhaustible. They break down a lot and are far more expensive to repair and maintain than a human being.

They're going to get better a lot faster than humans, though. The fact that they exist at all is remarkable.

Didn't they say this about LLMs but we still only have highly advanced slop generators, highly advanced autocomplete, and highly advanced search?

While they're impressively good in each of the aforementioned three fields, they're still not the world-changing technology they were supposed to be, right? (At least, not by themselves. When a very powerful human ties themselves to a slop machine, believing the output to be real, this can change the world)

The main achievement, besides search which is a very useful application, has been in how effectively we can get real people to believe total bullshit.

Re: Amazon's Vulcan Robots Now Stow Items Faster Than Humans

#295

Post by gamblor956 »

Closi wrote: post #285
gamblor956 wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AutoStore's patents were deemed invalid in the U.K. because they disclosed the invention prior to filing for the patents, which apparently is not allowed under U.K. law. Their patents were invalidated in the U.S. due to "inequitable conduct or equitable estoppel" meaning either that Autostore violated someone else's patents or that they led Ocado to believe that Ocado was not violating Autostore's patents in some way…

I think the story is probably something like: * AutoStore sold a solution to Ocado * Ocado started modifying their own installation. AutoStore gave them the rights to do this naively thinking it was for their own use. * Ocado started aggressively patenting their own modifications. * Ocado then decides it’s going to build everything themselves, and also start selling their own version of the solution and compete direc…

That can't possibly be what happened. First to file would not allow Ocado to have patented the concept of the robot sitting above a cell/tote as that was already part of the system they got and copied/reverse-engineered from AutoStore. Indeed, if what you hypothesized had happened, Ocado would be the poster child for an immediate return to the first-to-invent system as this would be precisely the scenario that critics were warning about: an unscrupulous licensor "stealing" an invention from the actual inventor.

Re: Amazon's Vulcan Robots Now Stow Items Faster Than Humans

#296

Post by Closi »

gamblor956 wrote: post #295
Closi wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the story is probably something like: * AutoStore sold a solution to Ocado * Ocado started modifying their own installation. AutoStore gave them the rights to do this naively thinking it was for their own use. * Ocado started aggressively patenting their own modifications. * Ocado then decides it’s going to build everything themselves, and also start selling their own version of the solution and compete direc…

That can't possibly be what happened. First to file would not allow Ocado to have patented the concept of the robot sitting above a cell/tote as that was already part of the system they got and copied/reverse-engineered from AutoStore. Indeed, if what you hypothesized had happened, Ocado would be the poster child for an immediate return to the first-to-invent system as this would be precisely the scenario that critic…

Why can't it? I think you may have slightly misread my post in terms of the single cell aspect.

> First to file would not allow Ocado to have patented the concept of the robot sitting above a cell/tote

Ocado patented the concept of a robot sitting above a single cell/tote, not the concept of the robot sitting above a cell/tote.

AutoStore's initial system was the first to have the robot sitting above a stack of totes, however the robot sat above two cells in it's original design (a 'cantilever design'). The settlement actually means that AutoStore cannot develop a robot sitting above a single cell/tote (note that their blackline robots sit across a 'tote and a bit' because of this - see image https://www.prnewswire.co.uk/news-releases/autostore-sues-oc...).

There is lots of historical complexity as with all patent cases, but the AutoStore loss in court doesn't mean that Ocado didn't copy them - it just means that Ocado have been judged to be legally allowed to copy them IMO :)

> Ocado would be the poster child [for being] an unscrupulous licensor "stealing" an invention from the actual inventor.

They absolutely are the poster child for this in the material handling world! This is widely known in the logistics industry.

Re: Amazon's Vulcan Robots Now Stow Items Faster Than Humans

#297

Post by Gracana »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #269
Gracana wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh yeah I agree with what you're saying, and of course they're working on this because they think it makes sense to do so, I just figure it's still a tricky sell even to replace $20/h humans. FWIW I design industrial equipment for meat processing plants, where you'd be lucky to get 6-7 months out of a robot arm. I wish it was affordable to use robotics there, because there's a lot that could be done to eliminate some…

What are the key contributors to reduced robotic longevity, both environmental and duty cycle? How can the robot last longer in harsh environments and aggressive duty cycles?

Harsh environment and poor maintenance.

High pressure hot washdown followed by cold temperatures is kind of a nightmare scenario for equipment. Also some of the plants use cleaning chemicals that will strip off paint and anodizing. The cleaning crews are poorly paid and poorly treated, so they're not going to be careful with equipment, which means you get damage to wiring and sensors from pressure washers.

On the maintenance side, technicians just have too much going on, and it's rare to find someone who has robotic-equipment-level skills. Of all the plants I've been to, I can think of only a couple that are suitable for that level of sophisticated automation. The rest would be SOL if their robot went offline, and we wouldn't be able to train them past that point.

I think for this to work, either the company running the plant needs to own the system and set up specific training and tasks to care for it, or it needs to be provided near-constant support from the manufacturer.

I think you can buy stainless robots that might be good for this sort of thing, but I've never looked into it much because we have a hard enough time supporting our much more basic products.

Re: Amazon's Vulcan Robots Now Stow Items Faster Than Humans

#298

Post by toomuchtodo »

Gracana wrote: post #297
toomuchtodo wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are the key contributors to reduced robotic longevity, both environmental and duty cycle? How can the robot last longer in harsh environments and aggressive duty cycles?

Harsh environment and poor maintenance. High pressure hot washdown followed by cold temperatures is kind of a nightmare scenario for equipment. Also some of the plants use cleaning chemicals that will strip off paint and anodizing. The cleaning crews are poorly paid and poorly treated, so they're not going to be careful with equipment, which means you get damage to wiring and sensors from pressure washers. On the mai…

Appreciate the time you took to reply, thank you for indulging my curiosity.
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