Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

theaiunderwriter.substack.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

291–300 of 927 posts

Re: An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

#291

Post by paulryanrogers »

j-bos wrote: post #206
chimpanzee wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Essentially: “information wants to be free”. I agree. But this must include the dissolution of patents. Otherwise corporations and the owners of the infrastructure will simply control everything , including the easily replicable works of individuals.

At least patents only last 20 years as opposed to nearly over a century for copyright.

In practice it's often longer. Drug companies queue up minor tweaks to their formulas and can threaten to sue anyone even close to the new way, even carbon copies of the now expired patent. Few can afford to win a lawsuit.

We need more courts and judges to speed the process, to make justice more accessible, and universal SLAPP protections to weed out frivolous abuse.

Re: An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

#292

Post by dcow »

echelon wrote: post #285
kokanee wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea of open sourcing everything and nullifying patents would benefit corporations like Disney and OpenAI vastly more than it would benefit the people. The first thing that would happen is that BigCorp would eat up every interesting or useful piece of art, technology, and culture that has ever been created and monetize the life out of it. These legal protections are needed by the people. To the Pirate Party's cre…

The original claim is false, > intellectual property [...] used over and over again, primarily by the rich and powerful, to stifle original ideas and hold back cultural innovation. There's nothing about IP which prevents you from creating your own. There are, in fact, a near infinite number of things you can create. More things than there exist stars in our galaxy. The problem with ideas is that they have to be good.…

> We won't need Disney to give us their opinion on Star Wars - we can make our own.

Disney would say that you can’t. And in the current copyright regime, it’s not unlikely that they’d convince the court that they’re right.

Re: An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

#293

Post by runarberg »

dragontamer wrote: post #195
pixl97 wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The first thing that would happen is that BigCorp would eat up every interesting or useful piece of art, technology, and culture that has ever been created and monetize the life out of it. Wait, I'm still trying to figure out the difference between your imaginary world and the world we live in now?

Thor would have red hair in the imaginary world, rather than being a Blonde man which was made to be a somewhat distinguished comic book character. The Disney or otherwise copyrighted versions allow for unique spins on these old characters to be re-copyrighted. This Thor from Disney/Marvel is distinguished from Thor from God of War.

> “Before starting the series, we stuffed ourselves to the gills with Norse mythology, as well as almost every other type of mythology – we love it all! But you’ve got to remember that these are legendary tales – myths – and no two versions are ever exactly the same. We changed a lot of things – for example, in most of the myths Thor has red hair, Odin has one eye, etc. But we preferred doing our own version.”

https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/54400/why-did-earl...

Huh, did not know that. As an Icelandic person I knew about Þór the Norse god much earlier than Thor the marvel character. I never really pictured his hair color, nor knew he had a specific hair color in the mythology. I actually always pictured him with a beard though. What mostly mattered though was his characteristics. His ill temper and drinking habits, and the fact that he was not a nice person, nor a hero, but rather a guy who starts shit that gets everyone else in trouble, he also wins every fight except one (he looses one against Elli [the personification of old age]). The little I’ve seen of him in the Marvel movies, he keeps almost none of these characteristics.

EDIT: My favorite story of him is the depiction of the fall of Ásgarður, where Loki and some Jötun are about to use the gods vanity against them and con them out of stuff they cannot actually pay for a wall around Ásgarður. Þór, being the way he is, cannot be around a Jötun without fighting and killing him. So rather than paying up (which the gods cannot do) Þór is sent to see this Jötun, knowing very well that he will be murdered. This betrayal is marked as the beginning of the end in Völuspá (verse 26).

Re: An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

#294

Post by paulryanrogers »

dcow wrote: post #279
II2II wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That Disney Corp can prevent you from viewing some collection of pixels, because THEY own it A world without copyright is just as problematic as a world with copyright. With copyright, you run into the problem of excessive control. This wasn't too much of a problem in the past. If you bought a book, record, or video recording, you owned that particular copy. You could run into disagreeable situations because you di…

You don’t need credit to talk about pop culture. I don’t need to credit the Indian Jones copyright holder when I paint a stunning likeness of Ford in a kaki outfit with a whip, even if the holder might try to sue me over it. Copyright and credit aren’t the same.

There are also trademark protections. I heard Ford actually trademarked his likeness to ensure he got a piece of the merchandise action.

Re: An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

#295

Post by slg »

tastyface wrote: post #163
mlsu wrote: post #137

I was really hoping that the conversation around AI art would at least be partially centered on the perhaps now dated "2008 pirate party" idea that intellectual property, the royalty system, the draconian copyright laws that we have today are deeply silly, rooted in a fiction, and used over and over again, primarily by the rich and powerful, to stifle original ideas and hold back cultural innovation. Unfortunately, i…

A different way of looking at it: AI, by design, defaults to regurgitating the poppiest of pop culture content. Every whip-wielding archaeologist is now Harrison Ford. Every suave British spy is now Daniel Craig. With the power of AI, creativity is dead and buried.

This is what was often missed in the previous round of AI discourse that criticized these companies for forcing diversity into their systems after the fact. Every suave spy being Daniel Craig is just the apolitical version of every nurse being a woman or every criminal being Black. Converging everything to the internet's most popular result represents an inaccurate and a dumped down version of the world. You don't have to value diversity as a concept at all to recognize this as a systemic flaw of AI, it is as easy as recognizing that Daniel Craig isn't the only James Bond let alone the only "suave English spy".

Re: An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

#296

Post by darioush »

photonthug wrote: post #268
r3trohack3r wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re setting court precedent that will apply equally to OpenAI as it does to the llama.cpp and stable diffusion models running on your own graphics card.

I don’t know about that, we seem to be so deeply into double standards for this stuff that we’ve forgotten they are double standards. If I aggressively scrape content from anywhere and everywhere ignoring robots.txt and any other terms and conditions, then I’ll probably be punished. Corporate crawlers that are feeding the beast just do this on a massive scale and laugh off all of the complaints, including those from…

oh they hate it so much when this hypocrisy is pointed out. better put the high school kids downloading books on pirate bay in jail but I guess if your name starts with Alt and ends in man then there's an alt set of rules for you.

also remember when GPU usage was so bad for the environment when it was used to mine crypto, but I guess now it's okay to build nuclear power plants specifically for gen-ai.

Re: An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

#297

Post by codedokode »

fragmede wrote: post #165
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has nothing to do with stifling innovation. I am yet to meet a writer who doesn't even attempt to write for fear that whatever they write will be found to be in violation of copyright (unless they are the type of writer that is always finding excuses not to write). Several people have made successful careers out of fan fiction...

JK Rowling never has to work again in her life because she wrote a couple of books that were exceedingly popular. Because she doesn't have to work, she's not been forced to come up with new stuff. How is that not stifling?

You pick one example and ignore thousands of writers who didn't even return costs after publishing a book. Also, as another example, a great Russian 19th century poet and writer Alexander Pushkin left lot of debt after his death. He supported publishing other writers but it turned out to be a commercial failure. Maybe this fact will make you less unhappy about supposedly unclouded lazy writer's career.

Re: An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

#298

Post by myhf »

mlsu wrote: post #137

I was really hoping that the conversation around AI art would at least be partially centered on the perhaps now dated "2008 pirate party" idea that intellectual property, the royalty system, the draconian copyright laws that we have today are deeply silly, rooted in a fiction, and used over and over again, primarily by the rich and powerful, to stifle original ideas and hold back cultural innovation. Unfortunately, i…

The problem with this kind of plagiarism isn't that it violates someone's specific copyright.

But the discussion around plagiarism calls attention to the deeper issue: "generative" AI does not have emergent thinking or reasoning capabilities. It is just very good at obfuscating the sources of its information.

And that can cause much bigger problems than just IP infringement. You could make a strategic decision based on information that was deliberately published by an adversary.

Re: An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

#299

Post by codedokode »

fragmede wrote: post #225
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

She made enough money selling books by the 5th book that she'd never need to do anything again and live better than 99% of people on the planet. What do you want? She's not allowed to make money selling books?

What I want is irrelevant. She's now able to rest on her laurels thanks to copyright. She's earned it. I very much enjoyed the books! Under our current culture and level of technology, that's the dream. But why shouldn't everyone get to live like that? we have the technology to feed all the people, it's just a distribution and organization problem. "just". Money, and capitalism is how we've organized things and it's…

> But why shouldn't everyone get to live like that?

Because we don't have that much money?

Re: An image of an archeologist adventurer who wears a hat and uses a bullwhip

#300

Post by dcow »

munificent wrote: post #286
r3trohack3r wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re setting court precedent that will apply equally to OpenAI as it does to the llama.cpp and stable diffusion models running on your own graphics card.

SGTM. Honestly, seriously. Imagine some weird Thanos showed up, snapped his fingers and every single bit of generative AI software/models/papers/etc. were wiped from the Earth forever. Would that world be measurably worse in any way in terms of meaningful satisfying lives for people? Yes, you might have to hand draw (poorly) your D&D character. But if you wanted to read a story, or look at an image, you'd have to act…

Obviously the former status quo wasn’t that bad. But the opposite is also true, AI democratizes access to pop culture. So now when I connect with a human it’s not to share memes, it’s higher order. IOW we can spend more time playing D&D because we didn't have to draw our characters.
Post reply on HN