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Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

pilaenergy.com

291–300 of 492 posts

Re: Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

#291

Judging by the negativity here you're going to be a massive success -- search up the dropbox, airbnb, coinbase and ethereum launch threads if you want to feel good about where you're at. :) That said, I like this idea -- a modern coordinated UPS. I live in an area where people have 3-10 days a year of no power; being able to pick and choose what power they'd use during an outage would be a significant benefit to them…

> Judging by the negativity here you're going to be a massive success -- search up the dropbox, airbnb, coinbase and ethereum launch threads This is not a new product, though. Battery power inverters with AC and solar input are a popular class of products. You can buy similar products with higher capacity and better solar input at Costco or Best Buy. I think people are confused by the "Show HN" tag and the misleading…

> and the misleading way it's being compared to a Powerwall, despite not being a comparable product

100% this. I had to read a whole wall of text to get to "it's a really fancy UPS". Definitely places that will be useful, but I think a lot of people here are far more excited by the possibilities of products like Powerwall which move us towards a greener future than by large, stylish batteries.

Re: Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

#292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> will be unsafe That is absolute BS - food is considered unsafe after the food itself spends 4 hours above 40*f, so the website you’re linking to assumes a fridge and everything in it immediately warms to 41+* upon losing power? Physics doesn’t work that way….

You've misread the table. 40F for 2 hours is the guideline. A typical fridge is around 35-38F. Anecdotally my parents had a fridge fail recently and the food heated up alarmingly quickly.

Sounds like your parents fridge was poorly insulated, and thus consumed way more electricity than a modern fridge needs to.

Re: Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

#293
post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great points! This is meant as whole room backup - so it’ll keep your fridge (and a few other small devices like wifi, etc) running for 2-3 days - a pretty long outage. It’s basically a huge, 21st century UPS. It can also do arbitrage and charge when it’s cheap and deploy the power when it’s expensive. The main problem with a powerwall is it doesn’t work for renters, and costs 20,000+ (and permits, etc) if you do own…

The portability of the unit also makes a great use case for off-grid, getaway or usage in a remote location, or perhaps just as an additional option for existing setups. Being able to plug it into a NA standard plug into a more capable generator (or other outlet) to recharge is useful. Without knowing the price point... van life folks have solar batteries and the published power specs seem to be competitive and usefu…

Price is $999 for people who pay $99 for pre-order. Normal price is $1299

Re: Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

#294

I don't understand this. It's a tiny backup battery with an expensive enclosure, with only 100W of solar input? How are you expected to run solar wiring with this in your living room? The places that can afford this rarely have power outages, so having an dedicated appliance sitting in your living room or kitchen for those 1-2 times a year doesn't make sense. The capacity is barely enough to run your fridge for a day…

It surely sounds like your regular UPS.

If it actually has a good sinusoidal output, that's something, but yeah.

Re: Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

#295

Judging by the negativity here you're going to be a massive success -- search up the dropbox, airbnb, coinbase and ethereum launch threads if you want to feel good about where you're at. :) That said, I like this idea -- a modern coordinated UPS. I live in an area where people have 3-10 days a year of no power; being able to pick and choose what power they'd use during an outage would be a significant benefit to them…

I personally remember sh*tting on doordash...what a stupid idea.

But this product isn't actually a new concept. Competing products have been out for years with better specs and prices, even.

Re: Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

#296
Looks pretty neat, but at 1.6KWh it's not enough for "any" outage, so it's not really comparable to a PowerWall, which has a capacity of 13.5KWh. That said, the price is also much lower. If I didn't already have a 2KWh battery and a 3KW inverter generator, I'd buy one.

Re: Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

#297

From your site: "For homes with electricity prices that vary throughout the day, Pila optimizes charging to help manage your utility bills." Based on experiments like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtNq-0kV8YM , I'm extremely skeptical. Can you back this claim? Also, why are people going to spend $1,300 on this when a good UPS is a fraction of the price, and (for example) an Anker SOLIX F3800 Plus is $3,200?

A UPS can usually only power 100W, not enough for most fridges. Pila can do 2.2kW, enough for fridge, microwave, internet, and coffee maker.

100W is a _very_ small UPS, I don't see any on the first page of the amazon listings that are that small.

Re: Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

#298
>What's been your experience with home batteries?

I have set up a solar array to charge a couple of LiFePO4 batteries that I use to power a 12V water pump inside a rainwater tank that serves part of our garden. It's similar to a home built NAS using JBoD since I just bought things from different vendors instead of buying a prebuilt system to manage the tasks. I'm building it out to supply lights, heat and cooling so I will be expanding over the summer.

I also bought an EcoFlow Delta 3 Pro or something like that for one of my kids who lives in an apartment in an old building in a large city in tornado alley. They have experienced power outages during storms and since they're working on their PhD right now and teaching classes I figured that backup battery power sufficient to power a refrigerator and a bunch of devices and that functions like a UPS would be handy. I don't have any performance data right now since they just got it this past weekend. It looks like a solid unit and has good specs.

I am in the market for a similar product to use here at our home. I like the whole house systems that are reasonably portable and can be charged from multiple sources. The Pila is interesting. I had considered the Jackery and the EcoFlow product lines but would like to work out how the Pila compares. Do you plan to add comparison graphics to your site so that interested parties can see where you shine and make accurate cost comparisons?

>What recent power outages have you had, and how were you affected?

Here in N Texas we had the Feb 2021 freeze and grid breakdown that lasted several days. I won't dig into the details about how part of it may have been intentionally manipulated to take advantage of knowledge about supply constraints to capture as much money from consumers as possible. Nothing surprises me about the corruption of these grifters running this state any more.

During this period, we did great because I'm kinda data-driven and was able to take notes about outage timing and duration and use that to our advantage so that we never lacked for hot food, water (we're on a private water well), heat (we have a wood-burning fireplace), or light.

I bought a big diesel monster, a 20kW generator/light tower, after all that but haven't done anything to connect it to my house panel yet. It is handy as pockets on a shirt for doing things out on the property though. I can pull it out to wherever I need power and run all kinds of stuff with it. I may keep it or just set it up to power my shop in emergencies or sell it to one of my dumbass relatives or some local redneck.

The power it produces is not conditioned so I need a way to clean the power if I am to run my workstation or network devices and a simple battery solution like the Pila looks great for this compared to that generator.

Many questions that I had have been answered on this thread or by reading your FAQ or the pages on your site.

I am interested in reserving more than one Pila. I see that they are available in four colors, none of which match the earth-tone palette that I use in my house. Are there plans to add colors or should I invest in rattle-cans and painter tape to help these units blend in?

From your order page where I took an order to checkout I didn't see a way to make a single order that would get me multiple Pilas, all different colors. If you are interested in buying multiple Pilas but don't want all of them to be the same color can you do that in a single reservation order or do you need to make separate orders for each color?

The first photo on your home page shows a Pila on top of a fridge. It looks large and I know the placement is done to illustrate some of the features of the unit and not to show how it would look in real life on my fridge since I can't imagine having that large unit hanging out to the outside door edge. My fridge has a decorative arch in the center that would cover part of the display.

Anyway, that photo started me thinking about the placement of the Pila. A fridge needs air circulation in order to function normally and there are minimum air gap requirements for the sides and top so that it can pull enough air over the cooling coils to be efficient. In the configuration shown in the photo I think that fridge will be struggling since the Pila will be exhausting some heated air as it runs and that won't help the fridge chill things efficiently. The side gaps are too small and the top gap is consumed by the Pila. Mounting it behind the fridge will subject it to all the things that appliance techs love to see - dusty cooling coils, tight spaces with insufficient clearance for airflow, opportunities for water problems, etc.

I think it could be hard to place a big unit like the Pila near a fridge especially if your kitchen has a built=in fridge cabinet since they usually are designed with minimal clearances and all models won't fit. What is the length of the power cord for the Pila?

What is the operating temperature range, and dust and water intrusion rating? I don't see this information in the tech specs. For something that may need to be installed inside a cabinet with limited air flow or behind an appliance like a fridge where you will see significant dust issues and share a cavity with an icemaker line these are useful things to know.

I see a powerstrip in your product line but don't see a way to order one. I like that it appears to use the same app as the Pila battery. It's possible that the unit pictured is renderware though.

Is this available or when will it be available? If someone buys the powerstrip will they need to pair it with a Pila for it to be useful or can they use the app with it to help them monitor power usage by things attached to it? What sets it apart from the plethora of other power strip options that offer more outlets, more connection types, but with a dumber interface?

I use temperature sensors around my property and other places. I noticed that the Pila will work with Home Assistant and in the app photo on your site I see the fridge using temp measurements from a sensor. Will you be producing sensors or is that intended to show that Home Assistant sensors can be used to drive part of the battery backup power usage? My sensors are from SensorPush and they are great. Maybe a partnership could be developed to bundle third party items with a Pila so that the buyer could build a system in one purchase.

In that app example there is power backup information given for multiple rooms. For that example are we seeing how the app looks with multiple Pilas in different rooms or are we seeing how a single Pila can distribute power in the event of a power loss?

Perhaps more info about the app could appear on your site. I know it is probably in a state of flux while you get all this ready but we all know what fluxed up things look like before they get polished for delivery.

One other thing that I did not see on the site is a view of the back of the Pila that would show the outlets, the power cord input, etc. Maybe adding a 360 view would clear that up.

I'll hang up and listen now.

Re: Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

#299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Judging by the negativity here you're going to be a massive success -- search up the dropbox, airbnb, coinbase and ethereum launch threads This is not a new product, though. Battery power inverters with AC and solar input are a popular class of products. You can buy similar products with higher capacity and better solar input at Costco or Best Buy. I think people are confused by the "Show HN" tag and the misleading…

> and the misleading way it's being compared to a Powerwall, despite not being a comparable product 100% this. I had to read a whole wall of text to get to "it's a really fancy UPS". Definitely places that will be useful, but I think a lot of people here are far more excited by the possibilities of products like Powerwall which move us towards a greener future than by large, stylish batteries.

Solar & wind are variable, we need more storage on the grid to charge when these sources are abundant and discharge when they aren’t. Pila offers the same greener future that Powerwall does & makes it so everyone (home owner, renter, condo, or apartment dweller) can be part of this greener future.

Re: Show HN: We built a Plug-in Home Battery for the 99.7% of us without Powerwalls

#300
post #288

I want to like this product but it’s far too limited for me. I really wish someone would make something like this for my AC though because that’s the biggest energy draw by far (aside from the EV). A cost effective battery system for the AC system during peak use hours would be very interesting for me.

Ac uses so much power it is impossiple to be affordable. it might be cost effective but the sticker shock will get you.
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