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Google's Results Are Infested, Open AI Is Using Their Playbook from the 2000s

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Re: Google's Results Are Infested, Open AI Is Using Their Playbook from the 2000s

#291

Post by hinkley »

WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #142
chimpanzee wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For whatever it’s worth, in response to the same question posed by me (“what is the ld50 of caffeine”), Google’s AI properly reported it as 150-200 mg/kg. I asked this about 1 minute after you posted your comment. Perhaps it learned of and corrected its mistake in that short span of time, perhaps it reports differently on every occasion, or perhaps it thought you were a rat :)

The median lethal dose (LD50) of caffeine in humans is estimated to be 150–200 milligrams per kilogram of body mass. However, the lethal dose can vary depending on a person's sensitivity to caffeine, and can be as low as 57 milligrams per kilogram. Route of administration Oral 367.7 mg/kg bw Dermal >2000 mg/kg bw Inhalation LC50 combined: ca. 4.94 mg/L ref: https://i.imghippo.com/files/yeKK3113pE.png 13:25EST (by a K…

That’s the danger with thinking in terms of LD50.

That’s half the people in a caffeine chugging contest falling over dead. The first 911 call would be much much earlier. I doubt you’d get to 57 mg before someone thought they were having a heart attack (angina).

Re: Google's Results Are Infested, Open AI Is Using Their Playbook from the 2000s

#292

Post by m463 »

jerf wrote: post #211

Don't bet on AI staying clean. A lot of HN readers conceptualize the forces attacking the integrity of the search results as just some isolated people taking occasional potshots, and then maybe slinking away if their trick gets blocked. It is probably a lot more accurate to visualize the SEO industry as a Dark Google. Roughly as well resourced, with many smart people working on it full time, day in, day out, with inf…

Google isn't a search company, it is an identification company. that is its moat.

Re: Google's Results Are Infested, Open AI Is Using Their Playbook from the 2000s

#293

Post by hansvm »

griomnib wrote: post #205
beejiu wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps a more common question: "How many calories do men need to lose weight?" Google AI responded: "To lose weight, men typically need to reduce their daily calorie intake by 1,500 - 1,800 calories" Which is obviously dangerous advice. IMO Google AI overviews should not show up for anything (a) medical or (b) numerical. LLMs just aren't safe enough yet.

Funny thing is you can train a small BERT model to detect queries that are in categories that aren’t ready for AI “answers” with like .00000001% of the energy of an LLM.

That's (obviously) a bit of an exaggeration. BERT is just another transformer architecture. Cut down from ~100 layers to 1, ~1k dimensions to ~10, and ~10k tokens to 100, and you're only 1e6 faster / more efficient, still a factor of 10k greater than your estimate and also too small to handle the detection you're describing with any reasonable degree of accuracy.

Re: Google's Results Are Infested, Open AI Is Using Their Playbook from the 2000s

#294

Post by hinkley »

jayd16 wrote: post #154
GiorgioG wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Describes my general experience with AI across the board. Copilot, ChatGPT, Claude, etc. It’s like I’m talking to a genius toddler. With ChatGPT losing 5 billion dollars on 3.7B in revenue this is unsustainable. It feels like the dotcom bubble all over again.

> genius toddler I think it's closer to a well spoken idiot.

A cat who can talk.

Re: Google's Results Are Infested, Open AI Is Using Their Playbook from the 2000s

#296

Post by hansvm »

nuancebydefault wrote: post #218
beejiu wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps a more common question: "How many calories do men need to lose weight?" Google AI responded: "To lose weight, men typically need to reduce their daily calorie intake by 1,500 - 1,800 calories" Which is obviously dangerous advice. IMO Google AI overviews should not show up for anything (a) medical or (b) numerical. LLMs just aren't safe enough yet.

If your calorie intake is just 1500 today, it is bad advice. If your calorie surplus is 1800, it is good advice. But I wonder, were those few words the full response? Information hiding to prove a point is too easy.

A calorie surplus of 1800/day is ~190 lbs/yr. Is that something people actually do?

Re: Google's Results Are Infested, Open AI Is Using Their Playbook from the 2000s

#297

Post by hinkley »

lubujackson wrote: post #66
toddmorey wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For quick simple steps like how to get a Bluetooth keyboard into pairing mode, it seems to work really well. I hated the prior world where everyone attempted to hide the real answer 3/4ths of the way through a useless blog post or YouTube video.

Which, we should note, didn't happen 10 years ago before the accountants took over search at Google. Those good, lean, helpful pages still exist. Google incentives websites to have pages of slop on everything now because they track how long you spend on a site as a "metric of a good match". Forrest for the trees...

Baking recipes are the fucking worst.

I shouldn’t have to read 2000 words to make a cheesecake. And I shouldn’t have to read it three times before starting to make sure I combine the ingredients in the right order.

Even the good ones are often subtly wrong. For example, never add baking powder or especially cinnamon to wet ingredients. Stir them into the dry ingredients first, then combine. Otherwise they clump. With cinnamon it makes it look bad. With chemically reactive ingredients it can lead to insufficient rise. Who taught you people to cook? Obviously not grandma or PBS.

I see a lot of people blame “stale” baking powder and while that is a thing, mixing it in wrong or subbing oil for butter or not chilling (eg cookie dough) is just as likely a culprit.

My friend made two sheets of cookies from the same batch and the second ones were terrible. She left the dough on the counter while the first batch was in the oven. Rookie mistake. And she has adult children.

Re: Google's Results Are Infested, Open AI Is Using Their Playbook from the 2000s

#298

Post by MichaelZuo »

lostlogin wrote: post #264
jerf wrote: post #211

Don't bet on AI staying clean. A lot of HN readers conceptualize the forces attacking the integrity of the search results as just some isolated people taking occasional potshots, and then maybe slinking away if their trick gets blocked. It is probably a lot more accurate to visualize the SEO industry as a Dark Google. Roughly as well resourced, with many smart people working on it full time, day in, day out, with inf…

> we're not the real customers any more. Were we ever? I didn’t pay for search. I don’t pay for email.

Yeah it’s hard to see how most HN user were the ‘real customers’ of Google at any point in time. It makes no sense to claim that.

Re: Google's Results Are Infested, Open AI Is Using Their Playbook from the 2000s

#299

Post by paul7986 »

Trying to replace Google w/GPT but....

- Local search results for businesses, phone #s, directions isnt available

- Im paying GPT subscriber and it constantly logs me out on my different devices

- Sora I can not upload photos of whoever & make them do whatever like https://hailuoai.video/ which is free and at times fairly convincing (fun for the 12 yr old in you lol).

I know GPT Search is new and Im excited for GPT to become a phone AI OS or Open AI & MIcrosoft developed their own phone with a new personal device paradigm... i.e. create a H.E.R. phone.. it's your personal AI Assistant that does all for you via text, voice, hand gestures, facial expressions, etc. Once you pick up your phone you see your assistant waiting to assist. You can skin your AI assistant to look like anyone living or dead (loved one could live on & help your throughout ur day). Probably some crazy ideas but a H.E.R. phone / personal device as described (some parts) would be something new/different and possibly give Apple and Android a run for their money!

Re: Google's Results Are Infested, Open AI Is Using Their Playbook from the 2000s

#300

Post by hinkley »

aix1 wrote: post #123
TiredOfLife wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stack overflow launched 16 years ago, when for many years most of google results already were expertexchange type of sites with the obfuscated answers hidden pages deep in the link.

> expertexchange This reminded me that, rather hilariously, it used to be called expertsexchange.com before adding a dash (experts-exchange.com).

Expert sex change will long be remembered. I recall there was an Italian site that had a very spicy “Le Tits Now” reading but it escapes me.
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