Earlier quoted context omitted.
let me guess: criticizing this law constitutes “harm” already. better not enter this jurisdiction for the foreseeable future
Do you feel better off in a jurisdiction where, for example, anti-vaxxing is promoted?
Yes.
UK's Online Safety Act comes into force
291–300 of 394 posts
Re: UK's Online Safety Act comes into force
#292Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is very difficult to see what your argument is here. Initially you state that people are defrauded - indeed they are, very effectively and commonly, via phone calls. Ofcom has regulated the telephone system since their inception, and can charitably be said to have achieved zero percent operational effectiveness in that time. The Act unquestionably causes harm - it makes it effectively impossible for open, anonymou…
> It is very difficult to see what your argument is here. My arguments are: * free speech is not a cornerstone of our national identity (despite John Milton's attempts to make it one); * social media causes genuine harm (but does not do so inherently); * the Act imposes a legal responsibility on social media platforms to limit harm caused by those platforms; and * while members of the HN community may have a personal…
> Alternatively, social media platforms can ban pornography. Facebook, Instagram and TikTok (amongst others) already do this; the problem is they don't enforce these bans. My perspective on this is that if you can't effectively moderate your social media platform in accordance with the social norms of your users' surrounding social context, then you shouldn't be operating a social media platform, and if you strongly disagree with your users' social context (e.g., users in, say, Iran), then you shouldn't offer your platform to them.
Regular pornography isn't bad. The problem is that sites like fetlife full of consensual adult content would be hugely undermined by all their users having to identify themselves. A lot of users are new to the community and very iffy about being exposed due to e.g. a hack. With good reason, not every place is as open-minded. But it gives people a way to truly express themselves. These sites are really important.
Banning pornography on mainstream social media is a very heavy-handed move too imo. I'm glad reddit still allows it.
Re: UK's Online Safety Act comes into force
#293> People in the UK will be better protected from illegal harms online What are these 'illegal harms'? I'm online 10+ hours a day for 10 years straight and never seen one. (not assuming they don't exist, but their prevalence/impact might be inflated). If you have to go looking for them, isn't this just 'whack a mole' (since 'online harms' will hard to 100% eradicate), but at the expense of destroying parts of the inte…
> What are these 'illegal harms'? I'm online 10+ hours a day for 10 years straight and never seen one. (not assuming they don't exist, but their prevalence/impact might be inflated). As I understand things, MPs who are on Twitter regularly get anonymous threats of rape, murder etc https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63330885 - credible threats, with two MPs murdered in the last decade. You and I have the luxury that we can…
> As I understand things, MPs who are on Twitter regularly get anonymous threats of rape, murder etc https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63330885 - credible threats, with two MPs murdered in the last decade.
1. Aren’t such threats already covered by existing laws?
2. They weren’t murdered on Twitter, so I fail to see how the Online Safety Act would have helped prevent this.
Re: UK's Online Safety Act comes into force
#294Earlier quoted context omitted.
Which kills any sort of online anonymity as all social media posts will be directly linked to your ID. This will make it much easier to go after anyone that is a dissident in the UK. Many these awful laws such as one being discussed are sold to us under the guise of protecting the children. The last time I checked 7 people a day were being prosecuted for speech related crimes in the UK (and I checked a while ago). Pa…
>Parents should be the ones that should be controlling their children's social media usage. I guess we should stop checking age when buying alcohol in pubs (_Parents should be the ones that should be controlling their children's alcohol purchases_) And stop checking age when buying cigarettes (_Parents should be the ones that should be controlling their children's tobacco purchases_) etc. It's illuminating that your…
> I guess we should stop checking age when buying alcohol in pubs (_Parents should be the ones that should be controlling their children's alcohol purchases_)
> And stop checking age when buying cigarettes (_Parents should be the ones that should be controlling their children's tobacco purchases_)
Yes and yes. These measures are completely ineffective anyway. Who hasn't been drinking / watching porn underage? Smoking is less prevalent where I'm from but it's not for lack of availability of elf sticks etc.
Underage people have been exposed to (normal adult) porn for decades. And it hasn't caused any issues with our society. If anything it makes sexual morale more free and lets people discover themselves without moral judgement.
Re: UK's Online Safety Act comes into force
#295The UK has a thing called non-crime hate incidents ( https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/non-crime-hate-in... ) where the police records alleged complaints about discrimination, even if they are not a crime (otherwise they would be hate crimes). This could be used to direct policing resources sensibly ("lots of incidents recorded at such-and-such a place, maybe we should patrol there a bit more") or to build a…
This is overblown. The police are responsible for deciding how to classify a report. Their decisions need to be audited to avoid corruption. Ergo they have to maintain a record of reports they decided were not hate crimes.
This is true but, non crime hate incidents can appear on enhanced DBS checks (criminal records): https://www.slaterheelis.co.uk/articles/crime-category/non-c... and https://www.london.gov.uk/who-we-are/what-london-assembly-do... - but bizarrely not on security clearances at least according to the London link.
I would hope that this along with any other disclosure where the police decided on no action would be treated appropriately and only disclosed/acted upon if the incident was really worrying. On the other hand, I can't help but feel if the incident is worrying enough would it not also meet the bar for a criminal incident?
I'm not really comfortable with the naming and the lack of due process to be honest.
On the other hand, being careful what you say on social media is a requisite in many careers as companies can and do perform private background checks.
Re: UK's Online Safety Act comes into force
#296Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you search slang for anorexia and bulimia (ana and mia, respectively), it comes up. The slang helps remove the stigma and feels more friendly/cool. Thinspo/thinspiration is another term used by that community. "Help me love ana". With that search, there are sites that come up [1]. These terms are also used on reddit, instagram, etc for people to share tips (to be better anorexics/bulimics). [1] https://strongerina…
Thanks for the example. > This website is for support for those with an eating disorder who feel alone and by themself with this issue. Where are people with anorexia and bulimia supposed to get support/information if forums about the topics are untenable? Many can't beat the condition, and there's potential benefit in learning to accept and live with it. I'm not saying the site is unequivocally good, just that it's…
> Where are people with anorexia and bulimia supposed to get support/information if forums about the topics are untenable? Many can't beat the condition, and there's potential benefit in learning to accept and live with it.
Sending an anorexic to a pro-ana site is like sending someone with major depressive order to a pro-suicide site. These sites are not support groups for people struggling to cope with anorexia, they’re sites that tell you tips for overcoming your body’s defences to starving it to death
Re: UK's Online Safety Act comes into force
#297Earlier quoted context omitted.
About banning ads for “certain types of porridge”: > …the majority of porridge, muesli and granola products will not be affected by the advertising restrictions but some less healthy versions (with added sugar, chocolate, syrup) could be affected. > Sometimes products may be marketed as, or perceived by consumers to be, healthy but in fact contain surprisingly high levels of saturated fat, salt or sugar. Source: http…
I know you think this is a gotcha but you're seriously advocating for the banning of advertisements of certain kinds of food? Based on the fact that what, some people aren't smart enough to read an ingredient label?
It’s worth noting that the UK provides free healthcare via the NHS. A healthier nation is in everyone’s interests, as it reduces the long-term costs of treating preventable ailments and diseases caused by poor diet.
Nations without universal healthcare are presumably less likely to concern themselves with the health of their citizens.
Re: UK's Online Safety Act comes into force
#298Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Is there any way that we can overwhelm them? Yes: leave the UK. I and a lot of high earners are thinking about leaving the UK because it's simply a punishing country where you have high taxes like others in Europe but nothing to show for them. It's also by far the most authoritarian western country, as exemplified by measures like this one. The way to overwhelm them is to sink the UK by having most of the people it…
The country doesn't need high earners per se, it needs people that contribute effectively. There are plenty of "high earners" that are parasites, contributing little and extracting much. It all makes much more sense once you realise that governments spend before they tax and so what really matters is real resources.
Assuming the country wants to import goods and services, then they are going to need to be able to sell goods and services. The desirability of the goods and services the country is selling can be roughly indicated by the population's purchasing power.
If more and more people are earning less, then that is not a good sign for the desirability of the country's goods and services.
Re: UK's Online Safety Act comes into force
#299Earlier quoted context omitted.
how is it not popular support? or your point is that plurality is not enough? or that in a different voting system (alternate voting, ranked choice, etc..) the winner would be completely different?
Conservatives + Reform got more votes than Labour. More people voted against Labour than for them. In any other system they wouldn't have won, and at the very least wouldn't have a majority. The other thing to consider is that the electorate basically moved to the right in 2024 (Tory voters moved to Reform), but parliament shifted hard to the left.
> In any other system they wouldn't have won…
I can think of at least one other system where they would.
Re: UK's Online Safety Act comes into force
#300Plugging the draft guidance into chatgpt: Age Assurance Methods: Effective methods: Open banking, photo-ID matching, facial age estimation, credit card checks, and digital identity wallets. Ineffective methods: Self-declaration, general disclaimers, or payment methods without age restrictions. So basically, ID verification will be required for any platform that may have adult/harmful materials.
Can you cite the law if you're going to make claims about it
It's not in the law... it's the guidance Ofcom is providing, linked in TFA, which I believe will be enforceable.
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/siteassets/resources/documents/cons...