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Bitcoin is over $100k

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Re: Bitcoin is over $100k

#291

Post by valval »

skwee357 wrote: post #260
ArtTimeInvestor wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's money for the ultrarich/lucky Ok, so let's say you buy 1 Bitcoin today and then we end up in that future. Now 21 million minus one ultrarich lucky guys hold one Bitcoin and one stupid poor guy (you) holds one bitcoin? Or would it make you part of the ultrarich lucky club?

Sorry, I'm not sure if I understand your question/statement. What I wanted to say, is that in its current form, bitcoin IS money for some ultrarich people who have enough of it AND are able to access a commerce world where you can actually buy stuff with it without converting it to fiat currencies. Because last time I checked, I can't buy milk with BTC in my local supermarket, but I bet I can buy some luxury/illegal…

What on earth are you saying? Money is money for some ultra rich people who have enough of it.

Re: Bitcoin is over $100k

#292

Post by robjan »

tobyhinloopen wrote: post #234
robjan wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Markets are not a zero sum game. When the price goes up, it goes up for all holders.

The price goes up (or down) because someone bought a stock at that price... For every buy, there's one sell. For every win, there's a loss.

A transaction is zero sum, the market is net positive. For the market to be zero sum, the market cap would have to be constant. If I buy something from someone for $1 then sell it to you for $2, I gained a dollar and you own a share that's worth $2.

Re: Bitcoin is over $100k

#293

Post by eric_cc »

skwee357 wrote: post #260
ArtTimeInvestor wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's money for the ultrarich/lucky Ok, so let's say you buy 1 Bitcoin today and then we end up in that future. Now 21 million minus one ultrarich lucky guys hold one Bitcoin and one stupid poor guy (you) holds one bitcoin? Or would it make you part of the ultrarich lucky club?

Sorry, I'm not sure if I understand your question/statement. What I wanted to say, is that in its current form, bitcoin IS money for some ultrarich people who have enough of it AND are able to access a commerce world where you can actually buy stuff with it without converting it to fiat currencies. Because last time I checked, I can't buy milk with BTC in my local supermarket, but I bet I can buy some luxury/illegal…

You can onboard to Bitcoin with $10 in USD and use it to buy groceries.

Re: Bitcoin is over $100k

#294

Post by eric_cc »

skwee357 wrote: post #261
fragmede wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The banks are in on it this time. You can buy crypto on Fidelity, starting with as little as $1. Whether that's better or worse than buying SP500 or QQQ or Tbills on their platform is for you to decide. So pay your taxes on $10 million, you'll still have 5 left.

But that's the point I'm making. BTC was "advertised" as either the money of the future, which it is not, or an investment instrument that allows you to bypass government restrictions, which again, it is not, at least not for the common folks. At this point, it's just a very volatile investment/speculation instrument.

> BTC was "advertised" as either the money of the future, which it is not

You keep casually dismissing it as money. Give it about 2 years and you’ll realize you were incredibly wrong about this take. Between country adoption, lightning, infrastructure, integrations - bitcoin is already there now but it will become undeniable in roughly 2 years time.

Re: Bitcoin is over $100k

#295

Post by eric_cc »

ConspiracyFact wrote: post #280
benchmarkist wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Money is a meme, there is no value it can measure other than whatever delusion people collectively agree to call "value".

The US Dollar is quite the meme! If you’re a US citizen and you have an income in any currency whatever, you have to acquire US Dollars to pay taxes with, or else you’ll eventually wind up in jail :)

Money based on violence.

Re: Bitcoin is over $100k

#296

Post by JeremyNT »

prng2021 wrote: post #113

$1k, $10k, $100k. Watching this nonsensical hype at every stage left me in disbelief. Funny thing is after all these years I’m finally realizing there’s no reason whatsoever why it couldn’t hit $1M, $1B, or go back to $1. Anytime we see a dollar symbol we assume something has value like a traditional asset, tied to tangible or measurable things like material costs, a company’s quarterly earnings, etc. But cryptocurre…

The amount of money flowing into it has been a real shock.

I too played with bitcoin many years ago, mining on my CPU. Like a sucker I got rid of it because it clearly was not useful at its stated purpose.

Why have we created an economy where this kind of speculation is rewarded so highly, while it contributes nothing back to society? It's nonsensical.

But once you accept that finance is kind of ridiculous (and completely decoupled from any meaningful work in the real world), you can see that there is no limit to how high it can go.

Re: Bitcoin is over $100k

#297

Post by cesarb »

eric_cc wrote: post #294
skwee357 wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that's the point I'm making. BTC was "advertised" as either the money of the future, which it is not, or an investment instrument that allows you to bypass government restrictions, which again, it is not, at least not for the common folks. At this point, it's just a very volatile investment/speculation instrument.

> BTC was "advertised" as either the money of the future, which it is not You keep casually dismissing it as money. Give it about 2 years and you’ll realize you were incredibly wrong about this take. Between country adoption, lightning, infrastructure, integrations - bitcoin is already there now but it will become undeniable in roughly 2 years time.

> Give it about 2 years and you’ll realize you were incredibly wrong about this take. [...] but it will become undeniable in roughly 2 years time.

I recall reading similar statements more than 2 years ago...

Re: Bitcoin is over $100k

#298

Post by genghisjahn »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #244
genghisjahn wrote: post #19

It’s way higher than I ever thought it’d be. I sold mine at $800 so maybe I’ve got some sour grapes here, but all this reminds me of the book “Devil Take The Hindmost.”

You're talking about mania that lasted, at the very most, three years. Is it really that intellectually honest to compare tulips, which can be grown everywhere, by anyone, with "something" that has been designed, on purpose, to have a diminishing issuance rate? Satoshi made it very clear, in the very first Bitcoin block, that Bitcoin was a middle finger to politicians ever printing more money to bail out the banks. I…

Housing went up for a long time and then what happened in 2008? That wasn’t a 2-3 year mania. Everyone thought houses were “safe as houses.” The stock market rally in the 90s went up until it didn’t in the .com crash. I’m not comparing btc to tulips, I’m comparing it to things that went up a lot and then went down fast. And if you come back with “btc is different” I’ll respond with “that’s what everyone says about everything else before it crashes.”

Re: Bitcoin is over $100k

#299

Post by xtracto »

fragmede wrote: post #258
skwee357 wrote: post #245

I'm failing to understand the proposition behind bitcoin. From what I remember, the amount of BTC is finite, so eventually we will run out of new BTCs, and by then, most will be held by big institutions and some individuals who didn't want to sell, and it will become yet another luxury commodity like diamonds or gold. Hence, the entire premise of "Bitcoin is the future of money" is kind of stupid, unless it's money f…

The banks are in on it this time. You can buy crypto on Fidelity, starting with as little as $1. Whether that's better or worse than buying SP500 or QQQ or Tbills on their platform is for you to decide. So pay your taxes on $10 million, you'll still have 5 left.

So, the question one has to ask is, why aren't banks and "serious" institutions now behind bitcoin? If it is a scam/fad/etc?

The story of Cryptocurrencies reminds me a bit of Linux: "it was a cancer to society" until it was not. And now everyone is adopting it and corps have fucked it with their "open core" offerings.

I myself think that the use case of "trustless store and transfer of value" has a LOT of more attraction to what detractors see.

Re: Bitcoin is over $100k

#300

Post by cesarb »

robjan wrote: post #292
tobyhinloopen wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The price goes up (or down) because someone bought a stock at that price... For every buy, there's one sell. For every win, there's a loss.

A transaction is zero sum, the market is net positive. For the market to be zero sum, the market cap would have to be constant. If I buy something from someone for $1 then sell it to you for $2, I gained a dollar and you own a share that's worth $2.

> If I buy something from someone for $1 then sell it to you for $2, I gained a dollar and you own a share that's worth $2.

It's easy to see that this is nonsense: I could buy a widget from someone for $1, then turn around and sell it to my brother for $10000, does that really mean the widget is now magically worth $10000, and we doubled our collective holdings? No, what actually happened is that we together still have that same $10000, plus a worthless $1 widget.

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