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Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

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Re: Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

#291
post #168

Here's Apple's big problem: it's not a replacement for so many alternatives because it isn't supported on all platforms. Safari? Not on Windows. Apple Music? This actually has a Windows client. I'm not sure how good it is. But Spotify supports Windows and even Linux. Apple Password Manager? Will this be tied to iCloud? Will I be able to use it on Android? If I no longer have an iPhone will it be a pain to maintain an…

Apple thinks "One Ring to rule them all" will work on mindless enough. But otherwise, yeah. Those who aren't mindless wouldn't want that.

Re: Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

#292
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems to be the case that commenters do not know that Keychain Access exists. Apple has tried various approaches of surfacing this functionality (eg the passwords panel in Safari and again in iOS’s settings app). This just seems to be the app-agnostic way of providing this functionality to everyday users, and probably a good thing as platforms move away from passwords.

No, Keychain Access is just a terrible app. It is sufficiently terrible that I'm 100% aware of its existence and instead choose to pay for a less OS-integrated, but far better app.

I am not sure what you mean by it’s “terrible”. It works well for me. It saves my passwords, generates secure passwords for me, works with Safari, and works with apps.

Re: Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

#293
post #145

I wasn’t expecting this much hate towards 1Password in the comments. I was using Google Passwords, then migrated to Apple, finally to 1P7 and now 1P8. It’s one of the best software I’ve ever used and I don’t know what I’d do without it. Same goes for Fastmail as well.

You'd try Bitwarden...

Re: Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

#294
post #168

Here's Apple's big problem: it's not a replacement for so many alternatives because it isn't supported on all platforms. Safari? Not on Windows. Apple Music? This actually has a Windows client. I'm not sure how good it is. But Spotify supports Windows and even Linux. Apple Password Manager? Will this be tied to iCloud? Will I be able to use it on Android? If I no longer have an iPhone will it be a pain to maintain an…

It's good that it's not cross platform, we do not need any more product monopolies, we have enough. Still there's a chance this will hurt the password manager market which leads to an even better outcome: we still have a monopoly but it doesn't make the product available on platforms most people use.

Re: Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

#295
post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> People don't want everything tied to one identity, one service, one login. I think this is exactly what _most_ people want. With password management specifically, Apple has had a Chrome extension available for a while now which has allowed me to use it on other browsers/platforms. Not ideal, but good enough for most. On top of that, they don't lock you in with passwords. You can easily import and export your passw…

> On top of that, they don't lock you in with passwords. Now that many sites are moving to passkeys or TOTPs, it would be great if Apple could not lock users in there as well. > Apple has had a Chrome extension available for a while now which has allowed me to use it on other browsers/platforms That's only on Windows and requires you to install iCloud tools locally, right?

The Chrome extension also works on macOS.

Re: Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

#296
post #168

Here's Apple's big problem: it's not a replacement for so many alternatives because it isn't supported on all platforms. Safari? Not on Windows. Apple Music? This actually has a Windows client. I'm not sure how good it is. But Spotify supports Windows and even Linux. Apple Password Manager? Will this be tied to iCloud? Will I be able to use it on Android? If I no longer have an iPhone will it be a pain to maintain an…

>> People don't want everything tied to one identity, one service, one login. I think this is exactly what _most_ people want. With password management specifically, Apple has had a Chrome extension available for a while now which has allowed me to use it on other browsers/platforms. Not ideal, but good enough for most. On top of that, they don't lock you in with passwords. You can easily import and export your passw…

> I think this is exactly what _most_ people want.

Like seven people replied to say this, but they're all missing the trick.

Most people want this because they're guided to want it. If you show people the convenience but not the risk, of course they want something with an advantage and no apparent disadvantage. But the disadvantage exists, it's just not immediately obvious.

Then some corporate machine learning algorithm decides that it's your day to have a bad year, or the screws only get tightened after you're already locked in, and the regret comes some time after the decision is made.

Whereas the nerds who can see the inside of the machine are aware that this sort of thing happens and their response is no thank you. A starkly different preference from the people paying the most attention is a troubling sign. It's the early stages of this:

https://xkcd.com/743/

The thing that gets me is that people then defend the practice because it's likely to be successful. Lots of unsophisticated people are going to put all their eggs in one basket and then have a bad time, which is a result we should be trying to prevent, not defend the people causing it because they're likely to turn a profit. Companies making money on information asymmetries and the misfortune of others is a flaw we should be looking for ways to optimize out.

Re: Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

#297
post #168

Here's Apple's big problem: it's not a replacement for so many alternatives because it isn't supported on all platforms. Safari? Not on Windows. Apple Music? This actually has a Windows client. I'm not sure how good it is. But Spotify supports Windows and even Linux. Apple Password Manager? Will this be tied to iCloud? Will I be able to use it on Android? If I no longer have an iPhone will it be a pain to maintain an…

> People don't want everything tied to one identity, one service, one login. This is what OAuth attempts to do, and most users and devs I know like it. I'm well aware of the risks of putting all eggs into one basket. I'm already doing it with 1Pass (albeit with external MFA for some sites), so I see no difference with letting Apple manage it.

> This is what OAuth attempts to do, and most users and devs I know like it.

Counterpoint from an interesting source:

https://gist.github.com/nckroy/dd2d4dfc86f7d13045ad715377b6a...

Re: Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

#298
post #247
post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple already has an iCloud app for Windows and has had an iCloud Password Chrome extension for years. There is no support for Android.

> has had an iCloud Password Chrome extension for years Which is also only available for Windows, as far as I know.

It’s also available on macOS.

Re: Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

#299
post #247
post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple already has an iCloud app for Windows and has had an iCloud Password Chrome extension for years. There is no support for Android.

> has had an iCloud Password Chrome extension for years Which is also only available for Windows, as far as I know.

And needs iCloud installed for it to work.

Re: Apple unveils 'Passwords' manager app at WWDC 2024

#300
post #168

Here's Apple's big problem: it's not a replacement for so many alternatives because it isn't supported on all platforms. Safari? Not on Windows. Apple Music? This actually has a Windows client. I'm not sure how good it is. But Spotify supports Windows and even Linux. Apple Password Manager? Will this be tied to iCloud? Will I be able to use it on Android? If I no longer have an iPhone will it be a pain to maintain an…

>People don't want everything tied to one identity, one service, one login. This is EXACTLY what people want. Please remember that HN is not a cross section of the general public.

I think they want one login, but don't want it all controlled by one company. I think they either like or just don't notice that everything they do is controlled by one company at first, until they see something shiny and cool that another company is doing, and realize how difficult it is to switch.
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