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Dear Europe, please wake up

klinger.io

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Re: Dear Europe, please wake up

#291

Post by steeve »

steeve wrote: post #264
subsubzero wrote: post #157

So many things here. Lets talk pay, US tech workers, lets just say Sr SWE and up, and lets look at SF as the author uses this as a focal point. Salary is roughly $300-400k a year(in SF FANGish company), in Europe or England its about half of that, and maybe even less. I know as I have family I married into that points out this fact, the best workers all go over to the US and make large salaries over there at US tech…

> In France you are not allowed to even layoff employees unless you are close to bankruptcy(I think this was changed a few years back). Of course, this is not true. What is true is when you hire somebody, they are on a trial period of 3-4 months that can be renewed once. After the trial period is done, you need a cause to fire them.

Downvotes? I'm french and run a company but please.

Re: Dear Europe, please wake up

#292

Post by kwere »

kazen44 wrote: post #247
kwere wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China has eaten European manufacturing, India will eat most of Europe Service jobs through remote positions. Europe will be saddled with debts, looking like a disfunctional Argentina squabbling about populist socialist /nationalist talking points.

except that globalisation is on the downturns, especially in terms of the political will in europe. Exporting the manufacturing of to china is currently seen by many as a mistake (especially deindustrialization in regards to military hardware). I highly doubt service jobs will be exported, especially considering the many different languages and the fragmentation of those languages.

Front-office jobs will be kept local, but expensive / labour intensive backoffices will be moved to cheaper places.

Right now Eastern Europe due to bilingualism is a Hub for this: Poland, Czechia, Romania, Albania.

India will become appealing when most European business jargons will be english first. Already happens in Software dev, Marketing, Product design, even Legal / compliance, etc...

Re: Dear Europe, please wake up

#293

Post by seba_dos1 »

alephnerd wrote: post #165
Muromec wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you are not providing critical infrastructure and people will not die, it's just you losing money, because your business is structured in a wrong way. You did it to yourself and should not expect people on salary to bear the cost of your wrong decisions. If you do provide critical infrastructure and people will die, it's also not my problem, because there will be a law requiring you to hire an SRE and a regulator…

You're entitled to your opinion, just like I am entitled not hire you and hire an Israeli, Czech, Pole, or Indian for the same salary (and I have). Btw, I'm in the cybersecurity space, so a Tier 1 escalation generally means nation state attack or business stopping attack on a customer. > You did it to yourself and should not expect people on salary to bear the cost of your wrong decisions. Plenty of escalations are d…

If you want people to be available on call, hire and pay them for an on-call job. As simple as that.

Re: Dear Europe, please wake up

#294

Post by t0bia_s »

omnimus wrote: post #288
t0bia_s wrote: post #183

As an EU citizen in middle of Europe (Czechia) I see two major problems. - Free market is crippled by EU economical politics. Basically, EU is trying to implement centrally planned economics and fund many useless things by grants. About half of grants (in my country) going to ideology driven nonprofit segment. Many EU citizens are very angry about wasting our money. Also, our government is not able to provide cheap e…

I am curious what are examples of “ideology driven nonprofit segment”?

Companies can finance EV cars from grants (8000 EUR) and charging stations. Photovoltaic on house for anyone who asks is cofunded (average 8000 EUR per application). https://novazelenausporam.cz/ Batteries and solar panels are about 98% Chinese production. Instead of making energy cheap, we basically finance from our taxes - in name of care about environment - something that is made in country, where there is no care about environment by our standards.

We have database of artist, voluntary joined by digital identity, that are open for work with companies (mostly PR - visual identity). After company choose an artist and they agree with collaboration, grants will fund about 80% of project costs (max. 8000 EUR). This cripple art free market because it give opportunity for unskilled artists to make something that company wouldn't pay by regulatory earned money. Company, that cannot see value in good design wouldn't profit from weak design anyway. As an artist, this frustrate me most. https://vouchery.kreativnicesko.cz/

In culture segment there are multiple film and music festivals that wouldn't exists without EU grants and funds. https://www.efa-aef.eu/en/initiatives/european-festivals-fun...

Feminist https://www.globalfundforwomen.org/ that is driven mostly by grants https://www.globalfundforwomen.org/who-we-are/financial-info...

Fighting against disinformation is driven by grants: https://gulbenkian.pt/emifund/grants/

There are plenty of those ideology driven nonprofit organizations that wouldn't exist without involuntary collected money (taxes) driven by centrally planed economics (socialism) with questionable benefits.

Re: Dear Europe, please wake up

#295

Post by fragmede »

creer wrote: post #285
subsubzero wrote: post #157

So many things here. Lets talk pay, US tech workers, lets just say Sr SWE and up, and lets look at SF as the author uses this as a focal point. Salary is roughly $300-400k a year(in SF FANGish company), in Europe or England its about half of that, and maybe even less. I know as I have family I married into that points out this fact, the best workers all go over to the US and make large salaries over there at US tech…

> 37% top US tax rate That's not true either. In California, you will also pay state income tax, most likely at 9.3% marginal rate - but possibly not too different in actual rate because the California thresholds are low. To continue the comparison, you'll need to consider which part of health insurance is or is not included (none in the US.) Etc. In the end, the marginal tax rates are pretty close. Meaning, shocking…

In California, you'll end up paying a total of 50.3% tax rate if you make over $1 million. Federal 37%, state 13.3% adds up to 50.3%

Re: Dear Europe, please wake up

#296

Post by defrost »

fragmede wrote: post #295
creer wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 37% top US tax rate That's not true either. In California, you will also pay state income tax, most likely at 9.3% marginal rate - but possibly not too different in actual rate because the California thresholds are low. To continue the comparison, you'll need to consider which part of health insurance is or is not included (none in the US.) Etc. In the end, the marginal tax rates are pretty close. Meaning, shocking…

In California, you'll end up paying a total of 50.3% tax rate if you make over $1 million. Federal 37%, state 13.3% adds up to 50.3%

Both state and federal are progressive tax brackets and the 50.3% tax rate is only paid on dollars earnt over a threshold.

https://youtu.be/4PJfDNfg5KI?t=77

Re: Dear Europe, please wake up

#297

Post by fragmede »

defrost wrote: post #296
fragmede wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In California, you'll end up paying a total of 50.3% tax rate if you make over $1 million. Federal 37%, state 13.3% adds up to 50.3%

Both state and federal are progressive tax brackets and the 50.3% tax rate is only paid on dollars earnt over a threshold. https://youtu.be/4PJfDNfg5KI?t=77

Yes, that's correct. If I did my math correctly, if you made $4 million, you'd end up with $2,052,391.57, which is an overall rate of 48.69%, for those that don't understand progressive tax rates.

Re: Dear Europe, please wake up

#298

Post by samuelstros »

rdm_blackhole wrote: post #286
samuelstros wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The problem with the EU wide Inc, is who gets the tax revenue? Every country proportional to the profit they generate and the tax rate they set? Companies overall EU profit $100M: - France $30M profit taxed at 20% = $6M - Germany $50M profit taxed at 25% = $12.5M - ... Seems like it "just" needs an accounting system that works across the EU.

You can't have that because each EU country has different incentives. Some countries tax salaries more than capital, other let you reduce your capital gains or offer a flat tax in certain circumstances. I forgot to mention, but if this EU Inc gets then created who gets the capital gain tax? Should it be divided in 27 or should it prorated to where you lived or where your customers live? Don't get me wrong, I would lo…

You seem to mix corporate vs personal taxation.

Personal taxation is always your country of residency. If you hold stock in an EU Inc., the capital gains tax in your country of residency would apply.

Re: Dear Europe, please wake up

#299

Post by fjdjshsh »

guru4consulting wrote: post #224
mountainb wrote: post #145

The EU does not have an equivalent of US commerce clause jurisprudence (which descends from Hamilton's original economic design to prevent exactly the kinds of problems that this author is complaining about). The EU does have an equivalent to the supremacy clause, but due to cultural and political forces it cannot have the same effect that it has in the US. Another major factor that makes the US more competitive is o…

And make EU more like USA? let them be influenced by corrupted wall street, loose EPA regulations for pesticides, favor the rich in the name of capitalism? In spite of the flaws and messy bureaucracy, I still like EU for their policies towards environment, food, socialism, etc. And above all, EU is the single beacon of hope to keep a check on mega corps like Apple, Google, Meta, MS, etc.

This point is not relevant, unless your argument is that all those nice things in the EU (which I agree are much better than in the USA) arise from the bad things that the author is talking about (lack of standardization mostly).

Let me put in another way. Can the EU solve the standardization issue and still keep the nice things you mention? I don't think they are related (at least I don't see a tight link)

Re: Dear Europe, please wake up

#300

Post by fjdjshsh »

fragmede wrote: post #295
creer wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 37% top US tax rate That's not true either. In California, you will also pay state income tax, most likely at 9.3% marginal rate - but possibly not too different in actual rate because the California thresholds are low. To continue the comparison, you'll need to consider which part of health insurance is or is not included (none in the US.) Etc. In the end, the marginal tax rates are pretty close. Meaning, shocking…

In California, you'll end up paying a total of 50.3% tax rate if you make over $1 million. Federal 37%, state 13.3% adds up to 50.3%

If you earn 300k a year, what's the average tax rate you're paying? (Marginal tax rate isn't a helpful number for that)
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