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NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

iapps.courts.state.ny.us

291–300 of 443 posts

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#291
post #30
post #10

Something I've been wondering in recent cases where courts are overturning recent government action, whether unconstitutional bills passed into law, or unconstitutional executive actions that overstep authority, is where's the penalty for committing those actions in the first place? The state of New York famously responded to the outcome of NYSRPA v. Bruen, which overturned the defacto ban on concealed carry, by decl…

>where's the penalty for committing those actions in the first place You've hit the core problem of society/government that countless generations have tried to obfuscate via an academic body that implies that social interactions can be studied/understood like natural sciences. At the core, all social structure is built on the threat of violence - Commit non-violent white collar crime? Show up to court, because if you…

Elon is bound by all the modern societal rules, markets and law.

He wanted to weasel out of his M&A agreement with Twitter. No luck, contract law is well established.

He is also wanted to just do automatic assembly for Tesla, no luck there. You might remember when they had to set up tents connected to the factory building to extend the assembly line, etc. all because the markets demanded results. (Many people were shorting Tesla.)

...

Sure, he built a nice cult of personality for himself, it allows him a few degrees of freedom in the eyes of those people. But the vast majority of the people don't know much about him, and don't care. Not everyone is glued to Twitter, HN, Forbes billionaires toplists, etc.

Similarly Trump built a bigger one. And a lot of authoritarian assholes too. It was the norm for a long time after all, pharaohs, divine kings, etc.

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because athletes and performers are irreplaceable and bring in tourist revenue which the city wants. Firefighters are more easily replaceable and have no effect on tourism. Having competing priorities is common enough, I don't see what doesn't make sense here. The city wants everyone to be vaccinated but it also wants broadway and basketball to be happening more, so they came up with this policy.

> Because athletes and performers are irreplaceable and bring in tourist revenue which the city wants. Firefighters are more easily replaceable and have no effect on tourism. I believe this is the most cynical thing I've read yet today. > I don't see what doesn't make sense here If the Athletes and Performers are so irreplaceable, then wouldn't you demand they be the most protected by the vaccine, and thus require th…

People are replaceable, resources aren't.

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I meant revenue that went to businesses/people in the city, like the general ecosystem not just the government. And a large part of the backlash was from people whose jobs were eliminated until full scale entertainment came back. It was a big deal to tons of people.

And I meant it's just simple corruption because there is little to no evidence that can be produced which supports the fringe theory that politicians care about the city's finances or what is and is not a big deal to the common people. They care about their finances and those of their friends and lobbyists and donors, so corruption is the simplest and most obvious explanation.

So you say there's no evidence for one theory then offer your own with no evidence?

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Same for many other jobs like garbage collection. Spoken like someone who hasn't been to New York. I love the city, its a fun and vibrant place. But they have some unusual trash policies (primarily they don't have alleys so trash has to be dumped on the main sidewalk) and wherever you go its not uncommon for the sidewalks to be lined with trash waiting for pickup.

I have been to New York and I have also seen Paris during a strike of garbage collectors. It gets ugly very quickly once collection stops. The number one thing I have noticed in New York was they seem to make trash collection as loud as possible ideally at 3 in the morning :)

How would they collect trash efficiently during the day when many streets are packed. Not to mention the extra traffic a slow moving often stopping garbage truck would cause

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#295
post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Home Depot was open because people need to fix shit around their house if you want them to stay home. What's arbitrary about that? I agree with you about the beaches. But in the early days, we didn't really know what worked and what didn't. People said 6 feet apart was safe enough indoors because "droplets containing the virus fall to the ground".

It was arbitrary because small hardware stores had to close, while big ones could stay open. Also, because in most states someone in the governor’s office just went down a random list of professions or business types and decided on the spot whether to shut them down or not. That’s the very definition of arbitrary and capricious. It also fails the rational basis test, since the government hadn’t even come up with a ra…

Then why?

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They were fired for cause, namely, insubordination The idea that you can order someone to perform a medical procedure because they work for you is disguisting. Where does this end?

> Where does it end? It ends with your survival. Vaccination isn't surgery, it's an extremely minor medical procedure that reduces or eliminates the risk of contracting a disease. During a deadly global pandemic, refusing vaccination is nothing short of suicidal . 97M Americans were infected and more than a million died. There were over 630M cases globally, and over 6.5M died due to COVID. The People have the stronge…

> The People have the stronger right to not be infected with COVID by you than your right to be infected.

The proper branch of government to decide this is Congress passing a law, not each major making it up as they go along.

It is definately distopian for employers to decide anything on this matter -they are not sibject to dempcratic scruitiny.

And there are many methods of reducing covid infection avaliable - installing air purifiers, improving ventillation in schools, Upper-Room Ultraviolet Germicidal Irradiation (UVGI).

If situation is so serious, whu are none of those being mandated? Now we know current vaccines give you immunity for like 6 months and new variants appear very rapidly.

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Christopher H. Achen & Larry M. Bartels wrote a whole book showing that voters do not keep track of what elected officials do, and so politicians are not punished for bad behavior, see excerpt here: https://demodexio.substack.com/p/longer-elected-terms-lead-t...

This is also shown in polling data, where congress on the whole has an approval rating of less than 10%, yet most years the incumbent is reelected That statistic alone has me questioning if democracy is a good system

Perhaps democracy is fine, but we are just doing voting wrong. See this page for some interesting alternative voting systems that have different / better outcomes: https://ncase.me/ballot/

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#299
post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am sorry, if you 'reject capitaliam' but have to check if 'your employer' cares, and pay 'your landlord' and go to the same grocery store, what exactly have you rejected?

I'm not the person to ask, but plenty of people claim to reject capitalism and participate in society like Rage Against the Machine.

Simple example - bhuddist monks, they don't take part in capitalism, they do their own thing.

Would you be allowed to build a monastery on top of a random mountain in America today? Clearly not. Force will be used to remove you.

So you portrailyal of 'anything short of terrorism is fair game' is totally inaccurate - the only way you are allowed to reject capitalism by selling tickets to a concert where you just talk shit.

Re: NY Supreme Court reinstates NYC's fired unvaccinated employees, orders backpay

#300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because athletes and performers are irreplaceable and bring in tourist revenue which the city wants. Firefighters are more easily replaceable and have no effect on tourism. Having competing priorities is common enough, I don't see what doesn't make sense here. The city wants everyone to be vaccinated but it also wants broadway and basketball to be happening more, so they came up with this policy.

> Because athletes and performers are irreplaceable and bring in tourist revenue which the city wants. Firefighters are more easily replaceable and have no effect on tourism. I believe this is the most cynical thing I've read yet today. > I don't see what doesn't make sense here If the Athletes and Performers are so irreplaceable, then wouldn't you demand they be the most protected by the vaccine, and thus require th…

Are there athletes or performers older than 55 so covid vaccination would have positive effect?
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