Earlier quoted context omitted.
Punishment/vengeance is a popular idea around here, but you have to also remember that a search engine is supposed to bring you the most relevant results. Filtering out, say, Stack Overflow or Reddit because it has ads doesn't help you when it answers your question and is perhaps the only thing on the internet that truly does. People seem to think there's this ad-less replica of the internet, sitting right behind our…
Maybe instead of heavily punishing websites with ads, a search engine could instead punish heavily ad-driven websites. A lot of the SEO-exploiting blog mills are filled to the brim with ads where the goal is to get you to visit to view as many ads as possible, not provide good content that's funded by ads.
What would a “good” WebMD look like?
291–300 of 323 posts
Re: What would a “good” WebMD look like?
#292Earlier quoted context omitted.
"that heavily punishes presence of advertisements in a result." while that is pleasing to read at face value, it has two fundamental problems: 1. it's orthogonal to relevance of content (semi-solvable algorithmically I suspect) 2. it's antithetical to Google's core business model (a lot tougher nut to crack)
> 1. it's orthogonal to relevance of content The entire point of my comment was that it's not orthogonal. The ads are what fuels the click bait and SEO-driven articles. Nobody for example would ever pay a subscription to a website that is just waffle filler. While stackoerflow has ads, it's much better in that regard to the SEO spam pages.
I hate ads, but I don't think we should be focusing on them here. Some sites that have ads have garbage content, and some sites that have ads have useful content. Just... find the useful content, and return it in search results. I know "just" is doing an awful lot of heavy lifting there, but I don't think "has/does not have ads" is as important a signal to a search engine's algorithm as you think it is.
Re: What would a “good” WebMD look like?
#293Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's a nice page, and I'll definitely bookmark that one. But I don't see most of the public using something like that over WebMD. WebMD is complete trash (I even block it in my Kagi search preferences), but it succeeds over sites like the NHS one because of blog SEO. WebMD is really a glorified blog with posts about every condition you might get paranoid over. I don't know how precisely they achieve this, but they'…
So there's a private option that's terrible (WebMD) and a private option that's terrific (Merck Manuals). And it's the terrible one that ranks well at Google. Sounds like a Google problem and apparently only a Google problem.
For example, somebody could search for "best rewards credit card for married couple with normal lifestyle" and find some listicle full of referral links that's a few years old. But the best advice might be in a Reddit or Twitter discussion titled "what's a good card for my P2 with no AF, low MSR, and at least 2CPP" whose replies are terse comments like "CSP?" or "BofA Custom; select CNP transactions as the 3% category and order everything online. they give high CL if you want to AU instead". There's enough jargon and levels of understanding that Google can't find the best advice, only good keyword matches.
I recently had a similar issue when I searched for something well-phrased and generic ("how to stop wood joints from squeaking"). The results were lackluster, but after a few attempts, I found the most helpful results were actually under a specific application ("how to stop a bed frame from squeaking").
So what's my point? It's not Google's fault. They are trying their best of optimize text search, with some fancy word associations and other stuff to help. But it's going to take a lot of effort to make an efficient, scalable, general-purpose AI that can achieve near-human understanding of text and then find the most relevant articles related to that. This "super-Google" would have to comprehend every post and comment on the internet, contextualize the knowledge ("a squeaky bed is caused by squeaky wood joints or fasteners, so this advice is useful for any kind of squeaking wood furniture"), and quickly generate results for every query.
It's not WebMD's fault they have ad revenue that lets them hire writers to SEO their articles with the best keywords. Nor is it Merck's fault that they are using specific language that doesn't cover all the phrases that a person could search. Nor is it Google's for making a search engine without human comprehension. It's just a technological gap that can't be bridged in the present day.
Re: What would a “good” WebMD look like?
#294Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's where I continue to want to see what results in a search engine would look like that heavily punishes presence of advertisements in a result. All the SEO spam pages are ad-driven, so cutting out anything following that incentive should result in removal of all pages that follow that terrible SEO spam pattern that ruins search results.
Punishment/vengeance is a popular idea around here, but you have to also remember that a search engine is supposed to bring you the most relevant results. Filtering out, say, Stack Overflow or Reddit because it has ads doesn't help you when it answers your question and is perhaps the only thing on the internet that truly does. People seem to think there's this ad-less replica of the internet, sitting right behind our…
Re: What would a “good” WebMD look like?
#295Earlier quoted context omitted.
Maybe instead of heavily punishing websites with ads, a search engine could instead punish heavily ad-driven websites. A lot of the SEO-exploiting blog mills are filled to the brim with ads where the goal is to get you to visit to view as many ads as possible, not provide good content that's funded by ads.
Do you mean the advertising company that runs a search engine should punish pages in the results that... show their ads? Or just when it's a "lot" of their ads? Or should they only do that if the pages are showing ads from their competitors?
Re: What would a “good” WebMD look like?
#296Earlier quoted context omitted.
Maybe instead of heavily punishing websites with ads, a search engine could instead punish heavily ad-driven websites. A lot of the SEO-exploiting blog mills are filled to the brim with ads where the goal is to get you to visit to view as many ads as possible, not provide good content that's funded by ads.
Do you mean the advertising company that runs a search engine should punish pages in the results that... show their ads? Or just when it's a "lot" of their ads? Or should they only do that if the pages are showing ads from their competitors?
Re: What would a “good” WebMD look like?
#297Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's where I continue to want to see what results in a search engine would look like that heavily punishes presence of advertisements in a result. All the SEO spam pages are ad-driven, so cutting out anything following that incentive should result in removal of all pages that follow that terrible SEO spam pattern that ruins search results.
Anyone who wants attention is motivated to do SEO. Should engines downrank every site that has good SEO? That is, downrank every site that ranks highly? They already look at things like clickthroughand dwell time and bounce back. If enough people dislike Example.com enough to avoid clicking on it or come back to search after visiting it, the engine learns that it is a bad result. Maybe the problem is that most people…
See: clickbait YouTube videos that show you something you really want to see in the thumbnail, then spend 10 minutes doing something else before showing it, and when you see it it’s a tiny aside with no more context than what you got in the thumbnail. If it’s even in the video at all.
Those videos have both high clickthrough (thus “click bait”) and also high dwell time (from people waiting for the thing they wanted to see to show up.) They do also have high bounceback, but only from people who recognize what’s going on. “A new sucker’s born every minute”, and those suckers will click the video and watch it, because they don’t yet know the principle that this specific kind of enticing thumbnail+title format implies that they won’t find what they want here.
These metrics all measure, effectively, “wanting” rather than “having.” It’s like measuring food by how addictive it is, rather than by how satisfied it makes you. You’ll end up optimizing toward cheetos — literally flavoured air — rather than toward anything that fills your stomach. People might enjoy cheetos while they’re eating them, but if they’re genuinely hungry, cheetos won’t solve their problem — they’ll still be hungry afterward.
Re: What would a “good” WebMD look like?
#298Re: What would a “good” WebMD look like?
#299Reading it makes your appreciate why WebMD exists. Not everyone wants to read highly technical medical jargon and read medical papers. But the HN audience probably has a lot of folks that are down to do that, and I strongly recommend UpToDate for those that do. I use almost every time I have a substantial new issue that requires a physician visit.
Re: What would a “good” WebMD look like?
#300> researchers published eight million new health citations—a 47% increase in all published health knowledge. So why hasn't any of this innovation made online health information even slightly better? Because the vast majority of this research does not change the current "standard of care" for most health issues that anyone is likely to experience. Trying to be your own doctor by reading websites is stupid. Doctors go…
Your last paragraph alludes to the gap in MDs, their strength is is in identifying and treating acute conditions that require surface level knowledge of everything. You will absolutely “outsmart”(ie consistently get better advice) if you are able to find a community of people living with your condition. You will get incredibly in depth reviews of medications, long term results of interventions, management strategies,…
Just don't expect miracles. Many chronic diseases are poorly understood and don't have effective treatments. Wishful thinking from a support group doesn't change that, and all the website researc in the world won't change that either.
My mom had ALS, we went to local support groups, and it was an utter waste of time, other than having other people to commiserate with.