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US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

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Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You think that Russia would "make North America glow in the dark" because the US disclosed cyberattacks that were obviously attributable to the US? Like, literally, bringing on nuclear Armageddon over some computer hacking and internet trolling? Actually not even computer hacking and internet trolling, just public acknowledgment about coputer hacking and internet trolling? I judge middle school debate and this still…

> over some computer hacking and internet trolling? No, no, "some computer hacking" (because who would worry about not being able to watch funny cat videos for a while? it's not like people do anything important using computers...) won't do much. But the next Stuxnet targeted at Russian infrastructure could well spell the end of us all. Honestly, I'd be quite content in that situation - witnessing, for however short…

Highly dubious.

But okay. Suppose there were a cyber attack sufficient to trigger full scale nuclear war and which also didn't fully disable Russian's nuclear armament.

Do you really think that Russia would not launch nukes just because the US didn't publicly declare responsibility for the attack even though Russia knows the US is responsible? Because, to be clear, that was OP's assertion:

>> And to make my point clear, the issue isn't that they're conducting cyber attacks - that's a given. The issue is admitting it, in the open, to the news media. Everyone knows this is happening, but you don't say the quiet part out loud because it's an escalation against a nuclear power and gives them carte blanche to retaliate.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#292
post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The thing about the Cuban missile crisis is that Kennedy was able to get Russian missiles AWAY from the United States. It only happened in the first place because the US put missiles in Turkey. Take them away and suddenly the soviet union is ok with removing the cuban nukes. In this case a simple "Ukraine wont be joining NATO" would have prevented this war. >Russia's actions are getting hardware placed closer. The s…

It's amazing how many people just can't seem to see any reason for Russia's behavior other than making their leader into a cartoon who just wants to do evil things to be evil. Honestly, since the Soviet Union collapsed, NATO has only expanded and crept closer and closer to Russia. How are they supposed to feel? As for this particular thing - the areas they are want are mainly Russian anyways and recent Ukrainian pol'…

Boris Yeltsin wanted it to be a long-term goal of Russia to join NATO - a measure supported by the United States (source: https://www.nytimes.com/1991/12/21/world/soviet-disarray-yel... or https://archive.ph/31hkF)

And they started down that road earnestly in the 1990s. But it required extensive military and certain Democratic reforms Russia didn't want to commit to so they abandoned it. And that's totally fine: nobody is required to join NATO. Ultimately, since the early 90s, Russia helped form the CSTO which serves a similar function.

> recent Ukrainian pol's have done everything they can to marginalize the people and their Russian cultures in these regions.

The current Ukrainian president is a native Russian speaker and was quite popular in Russia. They have spent the last 8 years dealing with a Russian-instigated (and supported) civil war with the so-called LPR and DPR. Is the southern United States oppressed because the Union didn't allow it to secede? That certainly was the argument people used to justify segregation!

Anyway, the stated justification for this war is not NATO expansion but "denazification"

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#293
post #246
post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m concerned the following might play out: -Russia wins in Ukraine -The sanctions were ultimately ineffective, for the reasons you explain above -China takes Taiwan during major US political unrest, at BEST destroying the fabs and at worst gaining full control of the leading 3nm/2nm etc process -A deeper China-Russia alliance, which was expedited by our ineffective sanctions now, puts the screws to US/western compan…

> Russia wins in Ukraine NATO population is 10 times that of Russia. The difference in economy/technology/production even more drastic. What winning are you talking about?

>> Russia wins in Ukraine

In Ukraine. NATO's population is irrelevant if Russia is not fighting NATO.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> any object measure, the sanctions have filled the Russian Government's coffers and made Europe much poorer With you until this point. Higher energy prices have in no way made up for the loss of Russia's reserves.

Russia has actually raised minimum wage and pensions by 10% due to the huge inflow of tax revenue. They also reduced the emergency 20% interest rate to 9.5% (about same as before). And I can't find the article, but I read somewhere that they're only losing about 1/3 of the original reserves that was originally announced. The EU is getting played by both Russia and America.

Is increased minimal wage a sign of something good?

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#295

The US government has completely lost the ability to act strategically. Biden is currently in Saudi Arabia begging for more oil production, meanwhile he's blocking measures to increase North American oil production. So, instead of fixing our own problem with inflation, we're asking one of the worst regimes on Earth for help and enriching Russia with higher prices simultaneously. Even if you support greener energy, li…

> he's blocking measures to increase North American oil production. How?

Not issuing drilling licenses? Besides, there is, or so I heard, so much political pressures that drilling has become a high-risk business that those companies either can't afford insurance or can't get one.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#296
post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Puh-lease. Any other argument other than that tired argument. As if the US military has not been complicit in similar business around the world.

Which of the two, Russia or the US, would you rather live in and associate yourself with?

Not sure how that question is relevant, but if you think the politicians and military brass are worried at all about the “murders of children and women” I have a bridge to sell you.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have to pick your battles and fact is, the American public wants to stop Russian atrocities in Ukraine. They don't want to do anything about Yemen or Syria. I'm sure many books have been written about how and why people get involved to help strangers.

Yes, Manufacturing Consent is a good one. The media & their masters tells us who to support. And Ukraine vs Russia is profitable.

It's simpler than a conspiracy, although a conspiracy may exist. Ukrainians are white, Christian, hold Western values and millions of people of Ukrainian descent live in the US and Canada. Opposing Russia is an easy sell.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is simply wrong as you dont take history and dont take future into account. History: brzezinski sums it up well. Russia has some weird imperialist interest in Ukraine. They have ZERO historical interests in the Nordics. Future: Finishing this war will take how long? Active conflict 1 year give or take + licking wounds 3 year + restoring economy and finding your way in the new world order 5 years + getting ready…

Specifically from a Finnish perspective: Russia has a weird imperialist interest in Finland. Our history can largely be summarized as "trying to cope with living next to Russia, with varying degrees of success". From the dawn of history, until Napoleonic wars, there was an invasion from the east every generation or two. The invasions only stopped after Sweden lost Finland to Russia. After Finland gained independence,…

So you, as a Finnish, are fine with Sweden controlling, occupying and plundering Finland for centuries, but complain about Russia doing the same, only for a shorter time. What's the difference?

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#299
post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't selling Crimea and recognizing the breakaway republics as countries work? It might be unacceptable, but it's definitely simple...

That's what they said in Munich in 1938 - just give Hitler the Sudetenland, that would work and satisfy him, he'll stop after that. Appeasing dictators with delusions of grandeur simply doesn't work. It might buy you some time, but you better prepare during it.

Buying time is the same as saving thousands of lives. I would hardly say that means it doesn't work.

Then there's the nuclear arsenal of NATO. Would Hitler attack Poland if it had nukes capable of putting an end to the Fuhrer himself, his Volk, and his Reich? From what I learned he wasn't suicidal until much later. Is Putin right now? Possibly, but I think he'd get assassinated long before his order to perform "special military operation" against a NATO country could reach his troops.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes the pope, a man who has dedicated his life to the study of religion and God an expert in global politics, that a quote from him has more value than a comment from anyone here. He mentions in the article that an unnamed world leader told him Russia would get upset at NATO being so close to their border. Putin has publicly mentioned this multiple times before the war with Ukraine. Finally, Ukraine has the ri…

> Finally, Ukraine has the right to join any alliance it wants and for Russia to invade over that is bullshit. In geopolitics, nobody has any particular rights. Whoever has the bigger stick and better propaganda gets their way. One could argue that there’s no reason to have sanctions on Cuba, that Palestinians should also have the right to self determination, that America doesn’t have the right to interfere in the de…

Please stop with this. Ukraine is an independent nation that can do what it wants. They may have wanted to provoke this war as Russia threatened it. That is their prerogative. It's possible they simply wanted to become part of Europe, and leave Putin, Luchenko, and the rest of the Eastern Kleptocratic Dictatorships behind. Can anyone blame them?

Sometimes it's because exactly what is obviously the reason.

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