HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS • Hacker News Board

Re: HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS

#291

Post by lrvick » Sat, May 21, 2022, 10:21 AM UTC

darthrupert wrote: post #248

loosescrews wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linux seems to have much worse memory management for desktop usage than other popular desktop operating systems. I have found that I really need 64GB of RAM to make Chrome run well on Linux, but I can get a similar user experience with as little as 16GB of RAM on other desktop operating systems. Firefox does much better, but Chrome seems to be the standard these days, and a computer that doesn't run Chrome well is pr…

Lol, that’s just silly. I could probably run Linux desktop (sway) on a 1GB RAM machine.

My early professional daily driver Linux workstations had 32-64MB of memory.

I laugh at discussions like this. Linux with a slim window manager and vim can run on just about anything and provide a productive programming environment for a codebase of virtually any size provided you can use a remote system for compiles and a slim browser like elinks to access online documentation.

That said my primary workstation runs separate VMs for every application for high security, so I appreciate my 64 cores and 256gb of memory these days.

Re: HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS

#292

Post by bscphil » Sat, May 21, 2022, 10:29 AM UTC

lrvick wrote: post #289

bscphil wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this comment is about 3 years out of date. Apple provides plausible value for money now, when it comes to laptops.

Hardly comparable. You can not actually own an Apple laptop. You buy some hardware that can not be used or repaired in any way Apple does not approve of... so it is not really yours.

That's completely irrelevant to the question of whether it's a good value for the money.

Re: HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS

#293

Post by d3nj4l » Sat, May 21, 2022, 10:36 AM UTC

lrvick wrote: post #289

bscphil wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this comment is about 3 years out of date. Apple provides plausible value for money now, when it comes to laptops.

Hardly comparable. You can not actually own an Apple laptop. You buy some hardware that can not be used or repaired in any way Apple does not approve of... so it is not really yours.

Evil Apple, they don't approve of running Linux so... oh wait

Re: HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS

#294

Post by Lio » Sat, May 21, 2022, 10:36 AM UTC

lrvick wrote: post #289

bscphil wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this comment is about 3 years out of date. Apple provides plausible value for money now, when it comes to laptops.

Hardly comparable. You can not actually own an Apple laptop. You buy some hardware that can not be used or repaired in any way Apple does not approve of... so it is not really yours.

Apple are not alone in moving towards closer integration.

I have a Dell XPS 13 Dev Edition 9370 and tried to replace the Killer brand wifi unit that’s about 80% reliable waking from sleep.

Turns out wifi is soldered in on that edition forward.

I think the same is true for RAM, although it came with 16Gb, which is the mac its processor supports.

Anyone else remember the days of socketed chips that would work themselves loose due to heat?

Putting everything into a single chip is a pain to upgrade but it does mean there’s less chance of things going wrong.

Re: HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS

#295

Post by Lio » Sat, May 21, 2022, 10:45 AM UTC

adolfojp wrote: post #156

ramesh31 wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Looks like Apple really has the “charge outrageously and be hailed for it” license. A new M1 Macbook Air starts at $999, and will put that Ryzen to shame. Not to mention infinitely better build quality and battery life. Apple has always been a great value for the price, even if that price is slightly higher than the bargain bin stuff.

It's $999 but it has half the RAM and a quarter of the storage. If you want to match those specs it jumps up to $1,649 which is $550 more than the HP. Is the Mac better though? Of course it is, but not everyone needs the latest and greatest and not everyone needs to pay $550 more for it.

The storage on Macs seems a bit mean for the price but story with RAM is more interesting.

From the benchmarks I’ve seen the M1 chips swap so fast that the penalty for less RAM is much less that I would expect on an Intel based laptop.

I’m pretty sure that if I was to move back to a mac right now I’d get 16Gb over 32Gb because there just isn’t much advantage to doubling the RAM.

I mean there’s a bit but to honest I don’t think I’d notice day to day.

Re: HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS

#296

Post by alluro2 » Sat, May 21, 2022, 10:51 AM UTC

loosescrews wrote: post #213

fatboy93 wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I didn't get the critique either. People are like we listen to music, have a few docker instances running and we use VScode, we need 32 gb Ram or more. Why do you need a text editor/ide which consumes so much ram? Is this the reason that apps have gotten more bloated and slow on older devices? Idk, I'm not a programmer. I think the price is fair enough, and if the ram isn't soldered (one would be and the other…

Linux seems to have much worse memory management for desktop usage than other popular desktop operating systems. I have found that I really need 64GB of RAM to make Chrome run well on Linux, but I can get a similar user experience with as little as 16GB of RAM on other desktop operating systems. Firefox does much better, but Chrome seems to be the standard these days, and a computer that doesn't run Chrome well is pr…

Just anecdotally, my dev workflows on Manjaro with KDE typically required ~18GB RAM (VSC, nodejs, rust, elixir, mongodb, redis, docker, db mgmt tool, browser, mail client, Slack, etc).

On MacOS (switched to 2021 MBP 14) basically identical setup is sitting on ~29GB.

I have no idea about Windows, but I don't think anyone would argue that there's much more room on Linux to adjust and optimize for lower RAM usage than on MacOS / Win

Re: HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS

#297

Post by alluro2 » Sat, May 21, 2022, 10:53 AM UTC

gameswithgo wrote: post #90

tristor wrote: post #29

I want to like this, but I feel like 32GB of RAM is minimum if I were buying a new laptop. I’ve been heavily eyeing the Framework but I’d prefer AMD. This had AMD but is limited to 16GB of RAM… lots of unnecessary tradeoffs being made here.

What workload do you do that 16GB isn't enough? Compiling large database backed .NET projects and Rust projects and AAA gaming all fit fine in 16GB

My dev workflows on Manjaro with KDE typically required ~18GB RAM (VSC, nodejs, rust, elixir, mongodb, redis, docker, db mgmt tool, browser, mail client, Slack, etc).

On MacOS (switched to 2021 MBP 14) basically identical setup is sitting on ~29GB.

I think my example is extremely average and common.

Re: HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS

#298

Post by Kwpolska » Sat, May 21, 2022, 10:56 AM UTC

happymellon wrote: post #232

ulkesh wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me introduce you to my friend Java.

Java sets upper memory limits, so that shouldn't be an issue.

Unless your stack involves 5-10 JVM apps (with the smallest ones generally working at -Xmx512m but some expecting around 2-4 GiB), and your IDE is also a resource-hungry Java app, in which case the bare minimum is 32 GiB RAM + about 10 GiB of swap.

Re: HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS

#299

Post by Kwpolska » Sat, May 21, 2022, 11:05 AM UTC

julianlam wrote: post #119

InfamousRece wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can definitely see myself using this machine. 16GB is enough for me as I don’t use electron. 8 core Ryzen is decent too.

I feel like a lot of developers overestimate the hardware specs that they need. My main development machine is a simple Ryzen 3 with 8GB RAM, and I run two electron apps (VS Code and Slack) at all times. A comment in a separate thread here mentioned virtualization. That and gaming would be two legitimate use cases, but for plain-jane development, "8gb ought to be enough for anybody" (har har)

What’s your full tech stack and OS, and how much swap/pagefile do you have? My personal Windows machine has 8 GiB, and it’s quite easy to fill it up by just running Firefox (with far too many tabs) and WSL, let alone an IDE.

Re: HP Dev One Laptop with Pop_OS

#300

Post by dzhiurgis » Sat, May 21, 2022, 11:31 AM UTC

usr1106 wrote: post #261

vbsd wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can scroll by holding down the middle trackpad button with your thumb and pushing the trackpoint in one direction or the other. You can even scroll horizontally this way. This is the main reason for the complaint about the missing middle button.

Why would anybody use a laptop keyboard and no mouse for serious development work? It's always an ergonomic nightmare. Of course when travelling light you might choose to leave extra stuff at home. But how many of us need to travel light to a new location before starting their daily work?

I've been developing from bed/couch for over 5 years. No regrets. Absolutely hate working from a desk.

Wish Apple came up with lightweight folding/sliding out displays for extra real estate tho.