291–300 of 458 posts
Everyone here seems to be talking about how great jQuery was for DOM interaction and that's true. But the other thing that was life changing about it was how easy it was to make ajax requests!
What's the "modern" alternative to jQuery in that regard? I don't do much JS development, but if I needed to make an AJAX request today, my first instinct would probably still be to use jQuery.
When I first started programming I was pretty lucky to get a job at a games company. My first lead was a veteran who had shipped a lot of AAA titles and he loved his war stories. He was personally interested in performance and he would often cite hardware timings for specific cpu instructions. One story he told a couple of times was about some grey beard who was before his time. The grey beard was once a legend in th…
> But to me, they are like the old grey beard who didn't update his knowledge as the times changed. Maybe it's just me but with all the rampant age discrimination nowadays in tech, I really don't like to see the continued propagation of this stereotype. All sorts of people of all ages are unwilling or unable to update their knowledge of new tech, there is no reason to link this characteristic to someones advanced age…
I can see how my choice of wording created an implication that people who have grey beards are old and that it is this oldness that contributes to their unwillingness to learn. The familiar cliche of "you can't teach an old dog new tricks".
What I actually hope to communicate is that there is a hubris which leads some to believe their skills do not require updating. The caution is that sooner or later this hubris may lead to sudden downfall. People may call on you in their time of need and you will fail. And this failure is not because of your age, your intelligence or your willingness to work hard. You will fail because you became overly comfortable with a passed status quo and you let your skills get out of date.
I see a trend of well-written, evidence backed articles where large, well funded sites are making a case to deprecate jQuery. These fact-based investigations into problems faced by their dev team result in a reasoned decision to remove a dependency that no longer justifies its cost. I encourage everyone to introspect if their defense of jQuery is on an equal technical footing to these types of investigations.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Update: fixed formatting A lot of times the jQuery syntax is easier to understand (IMO). Remove element exmample: jQuery API: $('.element').remove() DOM API: document.querySelector('.element').parentNode.removeChild(document.querySelector('.element')) or if you want to introduce another variable just to remove the element: const child = document.querySelector('.element'); child.parentNode.removeChild(child); Create e…
HTMLElement.prototype.remove exists everywhere except IE: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/API/Element/rem... Also for element creation: Object.assign(document.createElement("div"), { class: "foo", style: "display:none" }); I mean, you normally abstract these things with a helper fn or two, without importing the whole jQuery anyway.
Add enough helper functions are you're at jQuery anyway. Looking at the jQuery source code, it manages a lot of edge cases that I don't really have time to figure out on my own.
The DOM API isn't really designed that well for human consumption.
https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/API/Node/nodeTy...
When I first started programming I was pretty lucky to get a job at a games company. My first lead was a veteran who had shipped a lot of AAA titles and he loved his war stories. He was personally interested in performance and he would often cite hardware timings for specific cpu instructions. One story he told a couple of times was about some grey beard who was before his time. The grey beard was once a legend in th…
While I agree to some extent, jQuery is so prolific online [0] there will always be jobs for those “grey beards” who know it well. There will always be legacy codebases that make extensive use of jQuery that will never be rewritten and are too important to retire. jQuery is the new Cobol! I’m not a “grey beard” but I’m currently doing a freelance project updating the UI on a Perl+jQuery site… As much as we would like…
It's not COBOL until something replaces jQuery that is easier than jQuery.
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Do you see a lot of age discrimination it tech? What I have seen is awkward situations where you have two developers of roughly equal competence. One happens to be 45 and the other 28. Fine, nobody would care about that. Except that due to automatic annual raises, job switches, seniority bumps etc, the 45 year old developer is paid twice as much as the junior. The rational response to this would be to say to align th…
Really? I see 40+ people as diversity hires for the most part. They're there so no one can say the company is ageist. The "good" devs become managers or magically disappear. Magically as in they get banished to some other realm I've never been able to see. That, to me, says there's plenty of ageism. If it was as simple as "they ask for too much", then someone would snap them out of it and we'd see plenty of older dev…
I agree with you here - the question is why? I don't think it's because we're discriminated against for being old, I think it's because in 99% of cases (we can't all be donald knuth), our cost grows faster than our skills. So we either move to management/business (where experience matters more and it's much harder to quantify productivity), or we become "the overpaid one".
> If it was as simple as "they ask for too much", then someone would snap them out of it and we'd see plenty of older devs at software companies
But they wouldn't snap out of it. (a) in most countries you can't demote people, (b) it's very hard psychologically to accept being paid less for the same job
> more older engineers to show the younger ones how dumb they are.
I'm talking about 45+ vs 30 years olds here, not 30 vs 23.
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Other functions are much more difficult to replace $('.sth').closest('ul') To me jQuery is like Regex or Linq. I think it had a really good api.
You can also do this with DOM APIs, no? https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/API/Element/clo...
So the actually drop-in replacement of `$(foo).closest(bar)` would be something like:
Array.from(document.querySelector(foo)).map(el => el.closest(bar))Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But to me, they are like the old grey beard who didn't update his knowledge as the times changed. Maybe it's just me but with all the rampant age discrimination nowadays in tech, I really don't like to see the continued propagation of this stereotype. All sorts of people of all ages are unwilling or unable to update their knowledge of new tech, there is no reason to link this characteristic to someones advanced age…
Do you see a lot of age discrimination it tech? What I have seen is awkward situations where you have two developers of roughly equal competence. One happens to be 45 and the other 28. Fine, nobody would care about that. Except that due to automatic annual raises, job switches, seniority bumps etc, the 45 year old developer is paid twice as much as the junior. The rational response to this would be to say to align th…
Seniority bumps, x-weeks-vacation-after-y-years-of-service reward that intangible.
jQuery made animation and such easy to do. But now we have CSS for that.
There's no value in chest pounding and proclaiming "Tool X is stupid. No one should use Tool X." Given the diversity of the internet, it's naive to believe you understand every possible use case. Just let it go already.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But to me, they are like the old grey beard who didn't update his knowledge as the times changed. Maybe it's just me but with all the rampant age discrimination nowadays in tech, I really don't like to see the continued propagation of this stereotype. All sorts of people of all ages are unwilling or unable to update their knowledge of new tech, there is no reason to link this characteristic to someones advanced age…
Do you see a lot of age discrimination it tech? What I have seen is awkward situations where you have two developers of roughly equal competence. One happens to be 45 and the other 28. Fine, nobody would care about that. Except that due to automatic annual raises, job switches, seniority bumps etc, the 45 year old developer is paid twice as much as the junior. The rational response to this would be to say to align th…
Yep, especially culturally rather than financially. Almost everywhere I've worked there was the implicit assumption that engineers graduate out of coding jobs into management roles. In a lot of places there's the idea that focusing on writing software is some sort of career dead-end for older people which is a shame for anyone who just likes coding. I think it's widely perceived as a young person's job for no good reason.
And on the business side it's also pretty blatant. IIRC founders in their 40s are statistically most successful. Yet prominent people in the industry still openly fetishize youth.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But to me, they are like the old grey beard who didn't update his knowledge as the times changed. Maybe it's just me but with all the rampant age discrimination nowadays in tech, I really don't like to see the continued propagation of this stereotype. All sorts of people of all ages are unwilling or unable to update their knowledge of new tech, there is no reason to link this characteristic to someones advanced age…
I sympathize with older devs, my dad is an older software dev. But you kind of do have to be old in order to have outdated knowledge: nobody young is going to learn assembly tricks which worked on MIPS and other past architectures. Older devs and companies not constantly learning new things and updating to best practices is a real phenomenon. On the other hand, anecdotally most older developers actually do keep up to…
Not in the frontend dev space. I once left it for 2 years. when i came back it was a whole new world