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I Built a Shed (2020)

eduardosasso.co

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Re: I Built a Shed (2020)

#291

Post by pavon »

rectang wrote: post #150
14 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The simple answer is testing. When you go to school you get a test that certifies you have a basic knowledge. It may not cover every aspect but will teach you where to find the answers you don’t know.

Oh? School for what? Maybe general contracting? A while back I looked briefly into what it would take to be an electrician, and it seemed like there was quite a lot to know. I wonder how soon you get to the stage where you could wire up a shed like this with full confidence that you've done everything to code. From there, how many other subjects do you have to get right? I learned how to swing a hammer as a kid but I…

In my area, community colleges have trades programs for such things. I've gotten overrides for pre-reqs when I've audited classes for hobby rather than for the certificate/degree, allowing me to take the few core courses that cover most of what I'll get into in my projects.

Also, when applying for a home-owner permit, my city requires you pass a short test showing you know the basics of the code (not nearly as in-depth as certification exams).

Re: I Built a Shed (2020)

#292

Post by teh_klev »

eduardosasso wrote: post #246
Paul_S wrote: post #44

This whole thing is just a fire hazard but this is just dangerous advice to be giving people: "PRO TIP Use screws for everything; if you mess up, remove the screws and redo it; with nails, it’s a lot harder to do that." Please don't, screws shear. Don't learn constrtuction from someone who hasn't learnt it himself. As for writing about your experience like this, write a blog about something in your own field or other…

This is a 6x6 box geez. I’m not building a house.

I know, and feel for you. The level of overreaction here is beyond comical. Given this is HN in the San Fran startup zone I have to say that for a culture of break all the rules this lot are hilariously conservative just because you built a shed.

I like your shed.

Re: I Built a Shed (2020)

#293

Post by alex_sf »

unethical_ban wrote: post #270
amluto wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ignoring the type of conduit, there’s NM-B and CM (hopefully) in the same conduit. NM-B is not allowed outdoors (in “wet locations”) [0], and running your Ethernet cable and your power in the same conduit is no good. (Look up the code for feeders supplying structures — this is not even close to how it’s done. Maybe you can squeak by and consider this a structure supplied by a branch circuit, but there are still code…

What is NM-B? What is CM? What is WRB? What is OSB? If your point is to educate those without knowledge, a link or spelling some things out is helpful.

That's not the point. The point is that if you don't recognize the acronyms for non-metallic cable, comm multi, water resistant barrier, or oriented strand board, you should not be building a structure in a dense residential area.

Re: I Built a Shed (2020)

#294

Post by kelnos »

jefftk wrote: post #149
wbl wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The punishment for building code violations is death. The building code enforcement is a lot more lenient in comparison.

That's a pretty big overstatement. For example, using insufficient insulation is a code violation, but it is not going to kill you.

Poster seemed most upset specifically about the electrical issues. Those kind of things absolutely can kill you (or the next homeowner), or start a fire that can kill you, or your neighbors.

Re: I Built a Shed (2020)

#295

Post by kelnos »

R0b0t1 wrote: post #190
wbl wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The punishment for building code violations is death. The building code enforcement is a lot more lenient in comparison.

Most building codes are not a life or death matter. Most of them are windowsill clearance, door clearance, minutia about the spacing of steps. In some locations you have really stupid proscriptions about load bearing structure types (so e.g. you can't use a metal frame for your house simply because they specify you must use wood).

Most electrical building codes are indeed a life and death matter, and that seems to be the focus of the original comment, or at least the part that got the poster so upset.

Re: I Built a Shed (2020)

#296

Post by ketzo »

closeparen wrote: post #282
ketzo wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Basically make it easier and less of a problem for people to get inspected Totally agreed, and this post is the perfect example of why: people should want to be inspected! The whole point of a city building code is to have rules to keep people safe in situations that aren't obvious to, e.g., the DIY shed-builder. If I'm building a shed in the backyard, and I have the opportunity to call an employed expert to make s…

Building codes are complex and nuanced creatures. Safety features prominently but it is certainly not "the whole point." Some elements are for safety. Some elements are aesthetic: give the town a coherent look and feel. Some elements are economic: promote property value, ban what could be seen as ugly or low class. Some elements regulate interactions between neighboring lots: setbacks, placement of windows, rules for…

Just want to say that I really enjoyed this comment, and found some very interesting insights in it. Thank you.

Re: I Built a Shed (2020)

#297

Post by [deleted] »

speg wrote: post #264
sethev wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While you're not wrong about nails vs screws for framing - this a 6x6 box, it's not going to matter.

Signed in to say this. I built a shed in my backyard as one of my first DIY projects and also used screws. Not even structural screws, just standard 3” construction screws. The thing is solid. No one is walking around on it. It isn’t under the same stresses as a two story house. Like you said, it’s a box! I did my research, understood that nails provide better strength. I chose screws. So do many other shed builders.

[deleted]

Re: I Built a Shed (2020)

#298

Post by alex_sf »

speg wrote: post #264
sethev wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While you're not wrong about nails vs screws for framing - this a 6x6 box, it's not going to matter.

Signed in to say this. I built a shed in my backyard as one of my first DIY projects and also used screws. Not even structural screws, just standard 3” construction screws. The thing is solid. No one is walking around on it. It isn’t under the same stresses as a two story house. Like you said, it’s a box! I did my research, understood that nails provide better strength. I chose screws. So do many other shed builders.

Did you run 120v to it? Are you inside of it for 8 hours a day? Is it 3 feet from your house?

I'm all for hack jobs when the consequences are low. This is not one of those situations.

Re: I Built a Shed (2020)

#299

Post by parsimo2010 »

kelnos wrote: post #287
parsimo2010 wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Permits are for both safety _and_ tax reasons. Adding outbuildings to your property increases the value, so you should have your taxes increased, by the same logic that people with more expensive houses should pay more in taxes than people with cheaper houses. And property taxes, if properly codified and enforced, are a good way to ensure rich people can’t avoid taxes by hiding it in real estate. They also incentiviz…

> So unless you have some disagreement with tax in general or property tax specifically I could easily see (and probably agree with) the argument that we should be taxing land and not improvements. It feels a bit unfair to spend time and money to improve your own land, not be able to realize any gain/income from that improvement until you sell it, but meanwhile be on the hook for extra taxes every year. To be clear,…

Yeah, I wasn't trying to make the case that property taxes are perfect, but they are what we have. There are some bad features such as discouraging maintenance to keep the taxable value down. But it does act partly as a land value tax, since the land value goes into the assessed value calculation.

I'm sure some people would disagree with this argument, but buildings do increase the value of the land, albeit in a temporary manner. I personally would pay more for an acre with a house on it than an otherwise comparable acre with nothing. Sure, land is truly permanent and finite while houses fall apart over a few decades and can be renewed. But for my human timescale, the presence of a building is a valid consideration in the taxable value of land, as much as other things such as the terrain and proximity to water. And if you take a land value tax and also consider the value of the buildings on it then you end up with property tax.

I'd support a different set of taxes in the US (I'm pretty sure that's where OP built the shed). I'd happily let go of property taxes in favor of a wealth tax and a land value tax. I'd even take an honest accounting of how much things cost and forcing the people and politicians to get our tax to align with our spending so we aren't passing ever increasing bills to our children. But with the current political system there is a 100% chance those ideas would be corrupted, so I'll settle with the inefficient taxes we have now and try to be a good sport about paying them.

Re: I Built a Shed (2020)

#300

Post by alex_sf »

teh_klev wrote: post #292
eduardosasso wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a 6x6 box geez. I’m not building a house.

I know, and feel for you. The level of overreaction here is beyond comical. Given this is HN in the San Fran startup zone I have to say that for a culture of break all the rules this lot are hilariously conservative just because you built a shed . I like your shed.

There's a difference between deploying a buggy Javascript app and running 120v electrical to a shoddy lean-to.
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