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Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

theguardian.com

291–300 of 338 posts

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#291

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Can you give any insight into the solution you’re using to achieve this? I’ve got some noisy gadgets on my network that I want to cordon off, but I’m not sure where to begin.

Dedicated SSID(s) with that/those SSID configured as a guest network goes pretty far. I happen to use Ubiquiti gear, but most any router is likely capable of creating a dedicated guest SSID (or multiple). That covers wireless devices (which is all the IoT stuff that I have). The one aggravation I had was trying to get the Chromecasts to work correctly (where I wanted to be able to cast from a machine on the main LAN…

i have my chromecasts and computers on two different vlans and works just fine, but there are a few things you need to do, ensure MDNS works between then and open up a half dozen or so ports.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#292
post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Making something opt-out because you know that people would not opt in voluntarily is a class of evil on its own. It is simply fraud and deception.

Organ donation is opt out. Do you consider that evil?

it's not where i live

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the Tile bit is a non sequitur. There’s no need for a Tile tag to create a network connection to a remote serve. That functionality could have been implemented without Sidewalk (eg Apple’s Find My is completely differently), so I’m dismissing that justification from Amazon. I have a few Tile tags, too, and I hope their new Amazon partnership makes them start being useful. It didn’t need Sidewalk though.

When a Tile device associates to another device that detects it, that device has to send a network packet to the cloud that says that it found a Tile with a certain serial number. That’s using your network/your bandwidth to transmit proprietary data about someone else’s property, without asking your permission. That’s exactly the same in kind, just maybe not in degree. New Tile devices can play a sound on command. If…

if this was doing for tile what find my did for airtags i don't think there would be such an uproar - this is open internet for whatever the device and manufacturer want to do not an encrypted "hey katbyte your airtag is here" that only the user at the other end can read - i trust apple, and maybe i trust amazon, but i don't; trust the flood of rando devices that will use and abuse this

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#294

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I've seen this, too. Apple: Their device: "Hi, I'm an AirTag! This is my serial number!" Your device: "hey Apple, I was at (X, Y) when I saw this serial number." Amazon: Their device: "Hi, can I send traffic through your network?" Your device: "sure, buddy!" They're so fundamentally different that I pretty much assume a bad faith argument from people who say they're similar.

> Apple: Their device: "Hi, I'm an AirTag! This is my serial number!" Your device: "hey Apple, I was at (X, Y) when I saw this serial number." > Amazon: Their device: "Hi, can I send traffic through your network?" Your device: "sure, buddy!" I think you're mis-characterizing Amazon here. It's not "can I send traffic through your network", it's "can you pass this message to Amazon for me? Amazon will pass it on to my…

sidewalk device "hey amazon i want to talk to my manufacturer" amazon: "sure thing! let me pipe you through to them" manufacturer "lets connect you to whatever we want on the internet"

how is that not unfettered access to whatever the device wants via the manufacture's server?

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#295
post #64

I noticed this option in my settings months ago and disabled it then.

I had disabled it as well, but just checked and it was re-enabled.

make sure you check in 6 months to re-disable it from the bi-yearly "ooops our update enabled it again"

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#296
post #256

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The apple airtag devices do the same thing. They can get online via any apple device. Not sure if that applies to other FindMy devices though. I hope it does =)

When this tech falls into the wrong hands we are all so screwed.

This is the crux of the issue. I have spent a lot of my adult life in places that would horrify the average westerner. The root of the problem in recognizing what could go wrong with this stuff, is never having been exposed to a jurisdiction of political power which is run by murderous psychopaths outside a rule of law that benefits anyone but the psychopaths. Of course "authorities" will always continue to push boundaries and seek to embiggen the largesse of their power, but we in the developed world are so lucky! Most of us here on HN have won some sort of cosmic lottery with odds more infinitesimal than any other lottery that could ever exist. But an unfortunate side effect of never having been exposed to the various hazards of human civilization that almost every other human before us has endured, is not having built up any "ideological antibodies" against these sorts of things.

I've seen comments on Youtube that seemed shocked that Youtube could trace comments to an IP address! We are deep in it now, approaching a point where the barrier to entry to understand how the technology functions is too much even for capable specialists to fully comprehend the rampant abuse happening at this very moment. How often do we as technical people find out about some new god damned thing some god damned tech company is doing to steal our data or otherwise exploit us as "customers"? And even people who are technically capable of grasping the depth of the power of this technology are still busy hammering away on their keyboards to make it more powerful, having never had to worry about violent psychopaths with political power. We are creating a truly terrifying nightmare of brutal suffering for our grandchildren or their children.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#297

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You can opt out at any time. June 9th is just when they're turning the network on.

Ok, I stand corrected. I interpreted as inability to opt-out after that date.

The sensationalist headlines do phrase it that way.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#298
post #274

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"You can help me, I can help you". My smart lights work where I don't have connectivity, but you do, and your tile tracker works where you don't have connectivity, but I do. It's really quite similar to Apple's Find My network. I just wish this was going to some open collective where everyone could benefit, rather than just Amazon customers...

Helium is exactly what you describe. People deploy APs that provide coverage and in turn get fractions of pennies for transferring data from random peoples devices. https://www.helium.com/

I've seen this and it looks interesting. A true offline mesh large-scale network would probably not be feasible, so some kind of authority would be required. And crypto does seem to work for that to keep it decentralized, but I'm not sure I like their implementation. I've got a few LoRa radio kits and Raspberry Pis, but am not allowed to setup my own node. Rather I have to purchase one from them.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#299

Article doesn't mention it, but this is how you opt-out (there are others but this one has screenshots). https://www.tomsguide.com/reference/what-is-amazon-sidewalk Added to my list for the next time I'm on the phone with my parents, for our (weekly at this point) how-to sessions on "stopping the industry I work in from spying on you". I really, really wish product managers would understand the kind of ecosystem they…

> what problem does Amazon thinks this solves?

To that I ask: what problem does Alexa solve?? Why does one need a device to switch the lights?!? or turn music on or off. How much is one willing to pay for a minuscule, incremental particle of convenience.

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I think Alexa users only have themselves to blame.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#300
post #206

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Hah. Well, humans have easily predictable movement patterns right? Home, work, grocery store. Imagine wanting to move data from city A to city B, so they'd decide to do a Tinder match of a girl from City B to this guy from City A, so he'd visit her a lot and be the data conduit...

This is a terrific idea for a short story.

I think "unwitting mule" is something been happening for thousands of years, just with different tools.
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