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EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]

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291–300 of 780 posts

Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]

#291

I don't have a nice name for people in EU parliament that write these things, they don't really understand what encryption is. It's not a technology. You can't ban encryption. Terrorists can just use unencrypted chat and either use their own encryption or they can use predefined words and sentences that actually have a totally different meaning.

This is not from the Parliament. This is from the Council of Ministers. All shitty ideas in the EU come from there or from the Commission. These bodies are not elected and have very little, and very indirect, democratic legitimation.

They aren’t directly elected, but the minister is from the government of each country, which is elected (at least as most understand the term)

Parliament is directly elected

Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]

#292
post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about proposing encryption as an EU human right? Has that been attempted?

Maybe generalize that further, a right to privacy.

Perhaps, but see Article 8 which is cited in your sibling comment. It already contains a right to privacy.

But the term privacy is not very rigid. It can be taken and interpreted in various ways. It's certainly a good thing to mention it, but encryption needs to be mentioned explicitly, spelled out even.

There cannot be any room for interpretation: citizens have a right to encrypt their communication, end-to-end with their intended party.

Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]

#293

My german isn't that good, but from what I understand and from the translation below, the source seems a bit conspiratorial. I completely agree with the concerns raised elsewhere in this thread, but I'm not sure I see the clear link to recent events in Vienna etc claimed here. Here[0] is an earlier document from 21 october which the article seems to take some screenshots from, so it seems that this has been coming ei…

Thanks—we've changed the URL from https://fm4.orf.at/stories/3008930/. Submissions to HN need to be in English—we have great respect for other languages, including German, but HN is an English language site. Happily in this case, following the site guideline that calls for original sources solves this problem as well.

(I've taken the title from the new URL, btw, which uses the rather strong preposition "against"—I suppose this is a matter of interpretation since the document itself seems to fall over itself insisting on the opposite.)

Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]

#294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is also eye opening to watch how MEP vote. This is a farce and has nothing to do with democracy. They just want to enslave and control all Europeans.

You might want to provide more intricate detail about what you mean.

They push a button on a screen, which is publicly recorded as a vote for, against, abstain or not present.

Nowhere near superior systems like the U.K. where members leave te room, spend a couple of hours queuing to go into one of two rooms, and then see the result later in the day.

Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]

#295
post #262
post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>We live in a dangerous world. No we don't, but that's what the Politicians try to implement in our brains.

exactly; the terror ... stop being afraid and we avoid the collective need to sell our souls and those of our children for the protection of the state

Yeah - it is goddamn tiring can't the professional emotional manipulators that call themselves politicians play on any other emotion than fear to get elected?

Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]

#296

I want to also give some perspective why this is bad even IF we can make sure that only governments will have the keys. We have just uncovered an organized crime at the top levels in Slovakia where even the President of police is part of it and they influenced many court cases and were accessing secret information and databases on citizens, basically a mafia. And we are part of EU. I don't trust our goverment to use…

Yep, also scandals like the one in neighboring Austria where senior government officials were caught on candid camera making deals with fake oligarchs.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibiza_affair

Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]

#297

I want to also give some perspective why this is bad even IF we can make sure that only governments will have the keys. We have just uncovered an organized crime at the top levels in Slovakia where even the President of police is part of it and they influenced many court cases and were accessing secret information and databases on citizens, basically a mafia. And we are part of EU. I don't trust our goverment to use…

Another way of determining whether these proposals past the "smell test" is to ask how politicians treat legitimate requests for access to their communications (carried out as part of their jobs, which we pay them for) in response to Freedom Of Information requests.

An example[0] from 2012 in a (then) EU member state is very informative in that regard, as indeed is the name of the special adviser behind the controversial policy.

[0] https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17235168

Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]

#298
post #190
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems like such a gross oversimplification I don’t even know where to start. There will always be those in society who want to do harm for one reason or another, utopia does not exist. These people are what we call criminals.

Most criminals are criminals because of the circumstances. Circumstances can be improved but they'd rather spend 5.5 billion (the one after the million) € on Eurofighters than make away with poverty. We could go back and forth and it would change nothing at all because no one from the EC will see it and as an EU citizen I can't change the resolution, because the EP can't do anything about it. And just because there a…

> Why does the US have to plunder other countries? Instigate wars in other countries? If anything we should send to refugees to the US because they're to blame for it all.

It's not just the US, you said it yourself - France, Russia, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, the EU (agricultural subsidies make it impossible for local African farmers to compete with cheap, subsidised surpluses from the EU), Germany (weapon deals), China, and many others depending on region.

It's easy to point the finger to just the US, but in reality it's been European colonialism that started most of the mess in the first place. Just compare the borders in Africa and the Middle East to the borders in Europe and you might get an idea why peace and prosperity might be a long ways away.

> Most criminals are criminals because of the circumstances. Circumstances can be improved but they'd rather spend 5.5 billion (the one after the million) € on Eurofighters than make away with poverty.

The EU alone has a population of 440M. 5.5Bn is just 12.5€/person. Say 1 in 1000 people within the EU can be considered poor, that's still just 12500€ per poor person. That might be great for a year in many places, but then you'd have the same problem again next year. And the year after that, and the year after that...

Circumstances can be improved, but it doesn't start with money. The first step needs to be the disbandment of ghettos - way too many migrant families are segregated into their own streets, city blocks and quarters. Their children are stigmatised from birth and discrimination starts at an early age.

These people don't need money - they need a perspective, a fair chance, and acceptance. As long as football fans throw racial slurs even at their own players and as long as your country of birth, ethnic- and social background determines your future more than your skills, personality and hard work, being a terrorist or criminal has more appeal than being a productive part of society.

Re: EU Draft Council Declaration Against Encryption [pdf]

#300

I see this as follows: 1. Terrorism and trafficking of children will win the moral high ground. 2. App stores will be forced locale by locale to conform to these policies. 3. Most people will not notice or care. 4. This will be used by N-Eyes and totalitarian governments to quash dissent. 5. Meanwhile the tech crowd will create alternate app distribution mechanisms allowing those who care to communicate securely. 6.…

7. People in group 6 will be subject to increased abuse by authorities simply because they fall into this category regardless of whether other evidence suggests that they're a likely privacy advocate, political activist, or actual terrorist.

8. Privacy activists will leave group 6 by attrition, further reinforcing justification by authorities for 7.

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