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TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

reuters.com

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Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you fill us in what they did for those who are uninformed?

Chinese government didn't allow people in China to use US services (Google, Twitter, FB) and instead invested and marketed Chinese "clones" of these businesses (Tencent, Weibo, Baidu). Now that the Chinese owned TikTok is such a desirable app to use in the USA, the US government is blocking it in a similar fashion. To be honest it's all quite petty.

Wouldn't this embolden other countries to ban US made apps or tech unless they 'sell' a stake to their local companies? EU for example.

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#292

As someone from the third world this leaves a very bad feeling if it happens. I do expect it runs into legal hurdles before that. Neither Apple nor Google have found TikTok problematic enough to delist them from their app stores. Neither is there charges that TikTok may have broken US laws. Banning something which hasn't broken US laws, on arbitrary grounds shouldn't be possible. The President shouldn't have authorit…

We'll see when the EU uses that playbook against the US.

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#293
post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As much as I agree and being from a "third world" country myself, I can still remember China banning Facebook and Google in 2009/2010. Everyone has had to bend over backwards to gain access to the Chinese market while giving them free reign to the rest of the world.

Facebook and Google quit China because they didn't want to obey the speech control policy which not as democratic as in the U.S. They could have continued to operate in China had they chosen to follow the rules set up by Chinese regulators. With the TikTok it is a different story. They are willing to obey all laws of US and the Trump admistration still wants to ban it without sound reason. This is ridiculous from my…

How facile to compare the situations of companies "when they follow [China's] rules" and "when they obey US laws" as if they are equivalent.

America is being arbitrary, capricious, and unfair, in contradiction to the neutral and generally applicable law in America. But China's legal system has been arbitrary and capricious for decades, and is rotten to the core, consistently elevating the whims of the ruling party over rights and due process.

To use nonsense numbers: the US is designed to be 0% arbitrary but is being 20% arbitrary here. China is designed to be 90% arbitrary all the time. Clearly means China can keep out all the firms and be virtuous, but when the US keeps out any firms for any reason they're unfair and wicked!

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#294

As someone from the third world this leaves a very bad feeling if it happens. I do expect it runs into legal hurdles before that. Neither Apple nor Google have found TikTok problematic enough to delist them from their app stores. Neither is there charges that TikTok may have broken US laws. Banning something which hasn't broken US laws, on arbitrary grounds shouldn't be possible. The President shouldn't have authorit…

Not that it justifies our behavior, but I can’t help but cringe a bit when considering how China locks American companies out of its market but expects better access for Chinese companies in the American market. America-Chinese relations started going downhill in 2009 when China thought it prudent to start blocking most Americans services, America just took a decade to follow up with similar bad behavior.

> China locks American companies out of its market

This is something that is often claimed, but it doesn't reflect reality.

China does not generally lock American companies out of its market. In fact, American companies have a far greater presence in the Chinese market than vice versa.

For example, take a look at the 2017 China sales figures for a few American companies: [1]

* Apple: $44.7 billion

* Intel: $14.8 billion

* Qualcomm: $14.6 billion

* Boeing: $11.9 billion

* Micron: $10.4 billion

If you walk into any mall in China, you'll see American brands everywhere. Starbucks, KFC, McDonald's, tons of fashion brands, and on and on. The basic fact underlying all of this is that for decades, foreign direct investment flowed essentially in one direction: from the US to China. That reflected the fact that the US had capital, while China had labor. It's only recently that Chinese companies have begun expanding abroad, and FDI has started to go in the opposite direction.

1. https://www.marketwatch.com/story/trade-war-watch-these-are-...

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#296

As someone from the third world this leaves a very bad feeling if it happens. I do expect it runs into legal hurdles before that. Neither Apple nor Google have found TikTok problematic enough to delist them from their app stores. Neither is there charges that TikTok may have broken US laws. Banning something which hasn't broken US laws, on arbitrary grounds shouldn't be possible. The President shouldn't have authorit…

Not that it justifies our behavior, but I can’t help but cringe a bit when considering how China locks American companies out of its market but expects better access for Chinese companies in the American market. America-Chinese relations started going downhill in 2009 when China thought it prudent to start blocking most Americans services, America just took a decade to follow up with similar bad behavior.

Agreed completely. The degree of pressure that China applies outside of software is also very unsettling. The latest episode with the NBA allowing players to promote social causes on their uniforms for example...unless you’re supporting Hong Kong or Taiwan. It’s appalling.

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#298
post #156
post #112

Great policy. The EU needs to do the same with American big tech.

If the EU banned American big tech, they'd be set aback 20 years. Of course where would be a populist revolution. The difference between the EU and US on this matter, is that the EU has almost no substitutes, and they just don't - for whatever reason (there are many) have he will to do them. And of course there's no point - what FB is doing is no different from what a EU-based FB would do.

You know there is this movement called open source software right? With it not only a lot of strategical pieces of software are available to anyone to modify, but it also allowed people all over the world to contribute to them. This means that not only Europe but other parts of the world have people with enough knowledge to not only contribute, combine and use those things but also to 'push the envelope' in research and development.

BTW, a more decentralized, organic tech world, is something we should try to achieve, because as we are seeing now, there are no safe heavens for anything, anymore.

We should think more like human beings and less with nationalistic mentality, because all i've seeing til now, is nationalistic values being use not just to undermine other countries, but also undermine the nationalistic's own country.

If there's one valuable lesson history teach us, is that even the Rome empire, comparatively much powerful than anything we have now, started to fall when they corrupted the core values that served as a foundation of the Roman empire.

And nationalistic, the "we are better than everyone else", walls, stupid wars, etc..

But lets not forget an important difference here, right now all the achievements, the culture, the universities, the internet, the knowledge is widespread all over the world..

This is a pandora box effect, that once opened, cannot be closed anymore.

So even if the US totally closed itself to the world, im pretty sure the world would keep moving forward, and once this Donald Trump version of US lost it all and tried to become part of the world again, im pretty sure, it would be welcomed with open arms, and a catch up path would be offered to try to recover what was lost along the way. A sort of "Marshall plan" only that this time it would be to put the US back on their feet.

I hope the US dont keep going through this path that only leads to self-destruction..

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#299
post #140

The interesting thing is that these platforms come and go. One year it’s Vine, another year it’s Snap, now it’s TikTok. ByteDance bought musically for $1B in 2017 and turned it into Tok. 3 years later, it’s grown like crazy because it’s the latest fad and would be smart for them to cash out before the next new thing hits The whole divestment thing is probably a godsend for ByteDance, “forcing” them to liquidate their…

i don’t think snap is dead. not sure why people keep lumping it in with vine.

that’s like saying twitter is dead

Re: TikTok’s Chinese owner offers to forego stake to clinch U.S. deal – sources

#300
post #186
post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How? When China doesnt open up its fire wall for US apps, why should US allow Chinese?

When billions of people believe something, it will become a "fact". Right now the public opinion in China (not mine) is that India and America are hypocritical bullies and abusing the "national security" excuse, while China "never banned" any foreign web services, those "simply refused to comply with Chinese laws regarding terrorism" and their "inaccessibility" totally justified. You see, here's the logical trap, Tik…

> the CCP sabotaged and overthrew the Chinese Nationalist Party (now Taiwan) government exactly by exploiting its liberal constitution and free speech

This is some really bad history. The Nationalist Party was no defender of free speech.

The Chinese Civil War began in April 1927, when the Nationalists rounded up and executed thousands of Communists in Shanghai and other major cities.[1] What made this massacre even more shocking was that the Nationalists were allied with the Communists up until the moment they carried out the purge. That event set off the Civil War.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_massacre

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