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Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

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Re: Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

#291

Post by subhobroto »

Spivak wrote: post #289
subhobroto wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We were having a conversation about how passing regulations against surveillance at work is meaningless because just like all regulations, majority of companies will find ways to work around it while complying with regulations. When it became illegal to directly discriminate against race, employers found out ways to indirectly discriminate against race by putting in requirements for schooling and degrees that are jus…

So in your view regulation doesn’t stop anyone from doing what they want to do or we’re doing anyway. Doesn’t that imply that they can’t limit your freedom then? If regulations are totally ineffective why give them any mind at all?

> If regulations are totally ineffective why give them any mind at all?

Because each regulation is a fly constantly nagging at you. There's nothing stopping you from continuing to do what you were doing and if you concentrate enough, you don't even feel the flies but they are still there buzzing around and nagging at you.

It's annoying as hell mate.

What's one regulation that really changed your life?

Hold on, we are not done yet - now think of one regulation, without which you really could have, really, changed your life.

With those two now, let's talk.

Re: Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

#292

Post by dan_can_code »

This is a surefire way of making everyone employed at these businesses miserable. No one likes someone looking over their shoulder, especially for the entire working week. These companies are going to lose interest from their talent most likely. I feel for anyone working in these circumstances. I expect it will be extremely demotivating also.

Re: Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

#293

Post by sleepychu »

technofiend wrote: post #218
lonelappde wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or they can decline to let you connect to the corp net when you are out of office.

Which isn't really an option now that we have mandatory work from home. I'm not going to quit my job because they don't wish to supply me with a laptop.

Right, but now the situation is give and take. You want me to do work on my personal device? Maybe I'm willing to bring that to the table. You want me to install your spyware on it... not so much.

Re: Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

#294

Post by apecat »

cosmodisk wrote: post #4

It's being done by the same clowns who can't live without time clock cards, all sorts of monitoring,and tracking.These are the people who have no clue how to manage people,how to measure their work and act upon results.These are the same crappy companies who would rather ask their staff to email endless Excel spreadsheets to each other instead of investing some money in database or some crm system. In a nutshell,thes…

The levels of absolute dogshit thinking that goes into what's described in the OP is astounding.

Imagine that you're processing confidential customer data and you use something like https://hubstaff.com to take screenshots randomly. You're literally uploading PII to some professional spyware provider that works on a freemium model.

Re: Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

#295

Post by nicbou »

gfxgirl wrote: post #226
cosmodisk wrote: post #4

It's being done by the same clowns who can't live without time clock cards, all sorts of monitoring,and tracking.These are the people who have no clue how to manage people,how to measure their work and act upon results.These are the same crappy companies who would rather ask their staff to email endless Excel spreadsheets to each other instead of investing some money in database or some crm system. In a nutshell,thes…

I'm curious how much of this comes from working with unskilled labor (hope that's the right term). I once worked in fast food right out of high school. 80-90% of the employees were one or more of untrustworthy, unreliable, whiny, always making excuses or trying get out of work. My point being if you start there you might just assume that that's the way it always is for all employees no matter what type of job and the…

This reflects the experiences of close relatives with unskilled labour. In some fields, it's difficult to get people who consistently show up sober and on time. Those who can do this rarely stay for long.

Re: Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

#296

Post by blaser-waffle »

sumanthvepa wrote: post #15

I own a small business, and all of us, my employees and me work from home. We've been doing this from well before the COVID-19 epidemic. My team is mostly programmers with a one marketing person. This sort of intrusive monitoring is utter garbage. My team would quit if I used it and in any case, I don't want to know what they are upto by the minute. I don't even encourage realtime slack unless we've mutually agreed t…

Nothing about your business sounds like it reflects the rest of the white-collar working world.

Re: Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

#297

Post by _curious_ »

wolco wrote: post #287
_curious_ wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I moved out and 2000 miles away when I was 18

Hard to travel 2000 miles on foot without eating. Or land that first job without proper clothes. Either you had support or after you found that suitcase full of money things were probably easier.

What is the benefit of assuming things about other people whom you do not know?

I brought what clothes I had previously purchased myself from a minimum wage job I held for a few years prior. Growing up, if we wanted something, we worked for it (physical labor beginning around age 13). After moving out, I didn't eat much/well for a while there and got into debt because I didn't have a stable job/steady income for years to come.

When I realized that the subsidized housing that I landed was contingent upon providing "favors" to the landlord, I elected to go homeless at age 19. Couchsurfing, van life, camping, etc. Way of the road...

A couple years later I would file for bankruptcy flat broke - financially & morally.

The story continues for years of trial and tribulation without any familial or government support because I realized that dependencies are antithetical to personal growth and development. Eventually, I started my a company and during the first three years I worked on that for 60 hrs a week while netting less than minimum wage (eventually it paid off when I sold).

No-one is an island. It was because I opted-into (and out of) certain situations and relationships along the way (and developed proper human relations + work ethic) some amazing people extended their support at the right place in time. They will never be forgotten and are reminded to this day of the roles they had in shaping my world. I earned the trust and respect in every one of those relationships, those breaks, and those helping hands.

Establishing self-agency is step #1. Learning and living a life of self-reliance is #2. Once you accept, understand, and embody - there is nothing one cannot do and that is my message.

Re: Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

#298

Post by blaser-waffle »

gfxgirl wrote: post #226
cosmodisk wrote: post #4

It's being done by the same clowns who can't live without time clock cards, all sorts of monitoring,and tracking.These are the people who have no clue how to manage people,how to measure their work and act upon results.These are the same crappy companies who would rather ask their staff to email endless Excel spreadsheets to each other instead of investing some money in database or some crm system. In a nutshell,thes…

I'm curious how much of this comes from working with unskilled labor (hope that's the right term). I once worked in fast food right out of high school. 80-90% of the employees were one or more of untrustworthy, unreliable, whiny, always making excuses or trying get out of work. My point being if you start there you might just assume that that's the way it always is for all employees no matter what type of job and the…

I've seen plenty of bad behavior in tech. Ranges from unauthorized (but tolerable) use of servers for gaming after hours, to straight up time theft or physical theft.

When BTC was just starting out, we had one dev bring his own server to a data center and piggy back off a dumb switch for some NAS boxes. Free power for months and several BTC -- probably ~100k or more now.

We had a night admin printing out books on how to hack things from the work printer. Like 300 pages worth... which he forgot in the printer. He later tried to sell our certificates to random people via his work email.

One contract/hourly admin fudged his timecard 10 hours a week, every week, for months. He only was discovered when we did HR cost reviews and found that he was 500+ hours ahead of everyone else.

One of our junior linux admins brought his girlfriend into the NOC for a tour, then was caught on camera fingerbanging his lady on camera in the hallway just outside of the NOC door.

No shortage of switches, SFPs, half-step servers, and other gear going missing.

Re: Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

#299

Post by wolco »

_curious_ wrote: post #297
wolco wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard to travel 2000 miles on foot without eating. Or land that first job without proper clothes. Either you had support or after you found that suitcase full of money things were probably easier.

What is the benefit of assuming things about other people whom you do not know? I brought what clothes I had previously purchased myself from a minimum wage job I held for a few years prior. Growing up, if we wanted something, we worked for it (physical labor beginning around age 13). After moving out, I didn't eat much/well for a while there and got into debt because I didn't have a stable job/steady income for year…

"What is the benefit of assuming things about other people whom you do not know?"

It forces those with troubled egos to share. There is nothing more certain in life than telling someone they haven't had it hard enough to bring up their hardship story.

You are thinking through your own len. If I was able to make it everyone else should too. Quit your job immediately if you are unhappy or not getting paid enough is what you said. That's bad advice for those not looking forward. Accept short term paid for longer term gain.

Re: Work-from-home boom leads to more surveillance

#300

Post by dvtrn »

Gibbon1 wrote: post #224
poulsbohemian wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>My employer is still getting my eight hours, possibly more, just diffused through the whole day. Even that sticks in my craw... we need to make this 8 hour bar die. Some days I'm just not productive. Other days I might be heads-down on a problem for 15+ hours straight. So long as I'm accountable to my work and it is producing the results we've mutually agreed upon, this hour nonsense (for workers not billing by the…

My favorite is trying to figure out a bug and nothing I can think of provides any clue. So I do some other work for a bit and go home. And the next morning sit down down and fix the problem in 2 minutes. Obviously _something_ got done between last night and this morning. But how would you bill for THAT. Or an old example from a mentor. Get in the shower, start thinking about what you're going to work on today. Realiz…

>”obviously _something_ got done between last night and this morning”

https://youtu.be/yjdhNyEmYpo

I found this video last night lounging on the couch, the first segment talks about exactly what you’ve described, and the necessity to sometimes let the mind wander or do something else entirely when you’re “in the zone” but nevertheless stumped on a particular problem.

The video itself is about math and science but I think the applications extend far beyond.

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