Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube • Hacker News Board

Re: Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube

#291

Post by simongr3dal » Sat, Jan 26, 2019, 8:54 AM UTC

jlebar wrote: post #281

maxxxxx wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the AI stuff is really still incredibly dumb. Same for Amazon: Buy a mixer and suddenly you will be haunted everywhere by ads offering more mixers.

All the AI stuff is really still incredibly dumb. Same for Amazon: Buy a mixer and suddenly you will be haunted everywhere by ads offering more mixers Do we know it's actually dumb? Like, given that you just bought a mixer, perhaps in an absolute sense, you're unlikely to buy a second mixer. But relative to everything else that you might buy , perhaps you are very likely to buy a second mixer! There are huge financia…

Alternativly there are many matching and complementing products for a mixer (or any other products for that matter)

Just bought a mixer, how about: A new set of mixing bowls, alternative whisks and hooks, perhaps a set of measuring cups, a kitchen scale?

Just bought a new smartphone, how about: an external battery, screen protector (that fits the specific model), a fancy charging dock?

It really doesn't seems like it would take much intelligence to create these sets of complementing products and then use them for further ad targeting in the future, you could even use AI and ML to create the sets in the first place so you can fill out your buzzword qouta.

Re: Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube

#292

Post by londons_explore » Sat, Jan 26, 2019, 9:11 AM UTC

rasz wrote: post #201

Ivoirians wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you delete a video from your Youtube watch history, it doesn't get used for recommendations anymore. https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/95725?hl=en

Its a Lie. I have YT watch history disabled for hmm 2 years now, recommendations "work" just the same.

Disabling it != Removing a single item from the list.

Re: Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube

#293

Post by jobigoud » Sat, Jan 26, 2019, 9:24 AM UTC

PatentlyDC123 wrote: post #222

petermcneeley wrote: post #16

If they could simply make the "Not interested" feature work that would be great.

I would like a stronger option of blocking certain accounts that keep getting recommended.

I would like a spam bayes like detection and js modification add-on.

I would flag a video title as clickbait and the algo learns what I think, and then when it sees a similar title in the recommended list it removes the div from the page.

Re: Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube

#294

Post by tjoff » Sat, Jan 26, 2019, 10:39 AM UTC

jlebar wrote: post #281

maxxxxx wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the AI stuff is really still incredibly dumb. Same for Amazon: Buy a mixer and suddenly you will be haunted everywhere by ads offering more mixers.

All the AI stuff is really still incredibly dumb. Same for Amazon: Buy a mixer and suddenly you will be haunted everywhere by ads offering more mixers Do we know it's actually dumb? Like, given that you just bought a mixer, perhaps in an absolute sense, you're unlikely to buy a second mixer. But relative to everything else that you might buy , perhaps you are very likely to buy a second mixer! There are huge financia…

There are huge financial incentives to get these ads right.

Not really. All you have to do is convince companies that machine targeted ads are worth it. Apparently that is orders of magnitudes easier than actually recommending anything relevant.

Which isn't hard to imagine either, there aren't much competition after all. So the primary purpose of targeted ads is that it functions as an imaginary hammer you can use to squash new competition with.

Re: Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube

#295

Post by bengale » Sat, Jan 26, 2019, 11:14 AM UTC

manfredo wrote: post #100

jsheard wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way the algorithm pushes steadily more radical content is really concerning. Try making a completely fresh browser profile and deliberately browsing around right-leaning or "anti-SJW" channels and see how long it takes before YouTube starts pushing videos about white genocide and the impending destruction of western civilization by the muslim hordes (not very long in my experience). edit: I just tried this again…

Interestingly, YouTube actually recommends liberal content at a rate substantially higher than conservative content. Centrists content links to liberal content about three times more frequently than it links to conservative content. Is there evidence to corroborate the claim that YouTube is pushing people to extreme content? The data seems to indicate otherwise. https://www.thepostmillennial.com/does-youtube-facilita…

The extremity doesn't seem to be the same in my experience. It could be because I fall slightly more that way that it's able to get a better handle on my preferences but I don't find I get suggested the insanity of the left when I watch more liberal videos in the same way I do when I watch conservative ones. It's a tricky one to measure though.

Re: Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube

#296

Post by qbaqbaqba » Sat, Jan 26, 2019, 11:48 AM UTC

mindcrime wrote: post #145

My biggest problem with YT recommendations is that they dramatically overweight recent videos when generating the recommendations. I mean, I can spend a week doing nothing but watching (well, listening) to videos of classical music performances, and my recommendations will be full of classical music, exactly as you'd expect. Then I watch one random one-off thing, like "15 funny pitbull fails" and suddenly ALL of my r…

That's used to be the case for me, but since like a month I see more older content(also YT has removed date of when the video was published from right hand recommendations).

If I want something new, escape my bubble, I use other platforms like bitchute or peertube. Sometimes it's pretty scary but it's getting better.

Re: Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube

#297

Post by AltruisticGap » Sat, Jan 26, 2019, 12:06 PM UTC

gotocake wrote: post #112

AltruisticGap wrote: post #109

Manual selection doesn't bode well. I like to watch spiritual and metaphysical talks, Papaji, Eckhart Tolle, Conscious TV, Rupert Spira and the like. I don't want someone to tell me what's "true" or what's "real" by refering me to the so called "facts". Sounds like a slippery slope to me... There sure is a lot of drivel on YouTube.. much of it like content farms playing search engines, is driven by the ad revenue. I…

I don't want someone to tell me what's "true" or what's "real" by refering me to the so called "facts". Sounds like a slippery slope to me... It sounds at a first reading as though you’d feel everything since the Enlightenment has been a slippery slope. To be fair to YouTube though, if you want an environment devoid of “what’s ‘true’ or ‘what’s real’ by referring [you] to the so-called ‘facts,’” then YouTube seems li…

Garbage content in my opinion is mindless, soulless content created by content farms. Which in a way is what YouTube encourages through their advertising business. Same issue with low quality results in search engines due to all the content farms.

Any content that makes me question things is good in my opinion.

I had a period when I was into UFOs and whatnot.. and it led to an interesting realization about what I actually know. So in my view everything has its place. For example a video about flat earth may very well engage the viewer to wonder WHY the earth wouldn't be flat?

You can't force people to ask questions. Some people will get into the deep end and lose themselves. So be it. You can never force someone else to wake up out of their dreams. It's each individual's choice. At best it is only through the heart, and not rationality, that you can help someone see more clearly. Everyone believes n one thing or another, in order to feel safe.

And yes you are right. YouTube is absolutely perfect right now in some funny ways. Through the limitation of their own business model, they allow everyone to express themselves. And this is better for everybody.

I think they're going to stick to moderation politics and whatnot anyway, so who cares.

Re: Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube

#298

Post by Yetanfou » Sat, Jan 26, 2019, 1:07 PM UTC

kbrackbill wrote: post #255

Yetanfou wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're on mobile there's alternative ways of watching Youtube videos, at least if you're on Android: https://github.com/TeamNewPipe/NewPipe No ads, no direct tracking [1], just videos. [1] Google can still watch your device downloading videos of course...

NewPipe is great. I'm honestly kind of surprised that it's allowed on the play store.

One of the first things mentioned on that Github page is the following warning:

WARNING: PUTTING NEWPIPE OR ANY FORK OF IT INTO GOOGLE PLAYSTORE VIOLATES THEIR TERMS OF CONDITIONS.

Newpipe is available on F-Droid but that version is sometimes a bit old. The project maintainers suggest the following order of preference for getting access to the latest version:

In order to get this new version, you can:

- Build a debug APK yourself. This is the fastest way to get new features on your device, but is much more complicated, so we recommend using one of the other methods.

- Download the APK from releases and install it.

- Update via F-droid. This is the slowest method of getting updates, as F-Droid must recognize changes, build the APK itself, sign it, then push the update to users.

Re: Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube

#299

Post by webwanderings » Sat, Jan 26, 2019, 3:18 PM UTC

gundmc wrote: post #279

webwanderings wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you investigated their rabbit hole for children? YT for Kids simply needs to die. They are evil.

Have you used YouTube Kids in the last ~6 months? They made a lot of changes and enabled a mode where only human-vetted videos from topics/creators you select can play. I don't have kids but had assumed that problem was largely addressed.

No it has not. An average person wouldn’t have time to tweak the unknown changes thrown by unknown developers at them for their kids viewing experience. Nobody should trust the YT for kids because their primary motivation is not kids safety or education. When my daughter uses PBS Kids or Khan Academy Kids, I don’t have to worry about what they are throwing at her (relatively). YT on the other hand is a pure disaster waiting to happen to parents, if they don’t know (I was in that boat for some time).

Re: Continuing our work to improve recommendations on YouTube

#300

Post by tjoff » Sat, Jan 26, 2019, 4:17 PM UTC

wlesieutre wrote: post #53

What really bugs me is when a video literally has "Episode 18" in the name, but somehow the recommendation list on the right side fails to find the one with "Episode 19". But if I want to go watch Episode 5 again or jump ahead to Episode 26, it's happy to help. Awesome.

And there is no way to find Episode 19.

You know the exact date of Episode 18 so you assume Episode 19 was published soon afterwards. So you go into the profile and click videos.

You realize that the date is not even listed, it just says "x months ago", or "x years ago". And since this video was from two years ago you have to sift through all videos of the last two years. And you can't just ctr+f. You have to go to the bottom to load the next 30 or so videos.

The user interface for these kinds of sites are just incomprehensible poor.