Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees • Hacker News Board

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#291

Post by wlll » Tue, Oct 02, 2018, 2:37 PM UTC

dantheman wrote: post #268

swebs wrote: post #17

>In addition, the company also pledges its public policy team will lobby for an increase to the federal minimum wage from $7.25 — it doesn’t identify a specific wage that it’s targeting, but instead says, “We believe $7.25 is too low. We would look to Congress to decide the parameters of a new, higher federal minimum wage.” I'm going to take a wild guess and assume it will be $15/hour. That way they'll get to look pr…

This is disastrous for low skilled workers. It removes the bottom rung of the economic ladder -- if you have no skills or little skills, the best way to develop skills is to be employed. If you don't provide more than 15$ per hour of value then you won't be able to get a job. This also helps create a moat around amazon - if they can get the costs of everyone to go up, when they unleash better picking/warehouse automa…

I don't think that's how employment pools work.

Sure, there's an element of "this job is only worth $7.5/hour, so if we have to pay someone $15/hour we won't do it", but I'd suggest that those jobs are actually not that common.

I'd instead suggest that most jobs need doing, and they will just cost more. Ditches still need digging, burgers still need flipping, and it will just cost a bit more now.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#292

Post by CydeWeys » Tue, Oct 02, 2018, 2:38 PM UTC

RightMillennial wrote: post #193

WisNorCan wrote: post #43

With almost a million employees the decisions by Amazon are impacting a large part of the (150 million) US workforce. The dysfunction in our government is rising at a time that corporations are growing bigger than ever. The obvious result is that companies like Amazon will have an outsized effect on the major issues for our society, like minimum wage and healthcare.

Is Amazon seriously approaching 1 million employees?

It looks like they're at around 600K now worldwide. Most of these are not SWE jobs, of course. I don't know if that figure is only full-time employees though; if not, then the total number goes up substantially.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#293

Post by johnsushant » Tue, Oct 02, 2018, 2:38 PM UTC

mrhackerpoland wrote: post #256

As someone who worked in Amazon warehouse, it's still so crap. Average programmer gets paid $50-100 per hour without any health risk or lifting their ass off a chair. And we workers are paid $15 pittance. Salary of warehouse should atleast be equal to a web developer.

Skilled labour costs more than unskilled labour.

They're paid more because they cared to acquire skills that a warehouse worker didn't. It could be the coziest simplest job in the world, but if it has a higher skill requirement, it will come with a higher salary.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#294

Post by vthallam » Tue, Oct 02, 2018, 2:38 PM UTC

ptbello wrote: post #191

Call me cynical, but it could also be that AMZN will be automating all those lower paid jobs - as in: soon they won't even need 7.25$/H employees because they'll have machines. In this scenario, 15$/H would just be their current price point for the following tier of bottom of the chain not-yet-automated tasks.

This was my exact thought. It's great they increased the wages to $15, but it might also be because now they are in a state to hire fewer humans in logistics and carry out majority of the work through machines.

May be with less humans for $15/hour and machines, their average per unit hour cost is still $7.25.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#295

Post by ada1981 » Tue, Oct 02, 2018, 2:39 PM UTC

This is a great way to do it.

Much rather have companies adopt progressive policy then lobby for competitors to have to adopt it vs. lobbying to resist progressive policy.

Plus, they get the PR bonus, they will siphon off the best workers until it’s mandated everywhere, and when it is, they will have benefited and then be on equal playing field.

What are the downsides? (Unless you don’t want $15/hr min wage).

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#296

Post by turtlecloud » Tue, Oct 02, 2018, 2:39 PM UTC

ttoinou wrote: post #159

ralmidani wrote: post #39

Amazon should be commended for making a move in the right direction. I personally think people should be paid more. $15 * 40 * 52 comes out to $31,200. Before payroll and income taxes. That's barely enough to survive in a small city like Flint, MI (I live in a suburb of Flint), let alone somewhere like NYC, Seattle, or SF.

I think that they should be paid one million dollars each month, because why not, and creating inflation is always good for the economy

You poor soul. You actually think paying workers more creates inflation

You obviously haven’t heard of bankers, the federal reserve, and quantitative easing.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#297

Post by ck425 » Tue, Oct 02, 2018, 2:42 PM UTC

Hmm, I wonder how much Amazon expect their sales to increase by if a $15 minimum wage in implemented. Could it be a case that they expect the increase in customer spending to offset the costs?

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#298

Post by ttoinou » Tue, Oct 02, 2018, 2:42 PM UTC

CydeWeys wrote: post #273

ttoinou wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no definition of "minimum", "basic living", "safe conditions", "fair hours" etc. Fair hours used to be 10 hours a day 6 days / week. Living used to be able to survive a famine. Safe conditions used to be hunting for animals. All it matters is people interacting voluntarily, that's the only argument against minimum wage. But it is disingenuous to suggest that just because there are people who would take such…

I'm not following this argument. So, because the world used to terrible centuries ago, and still is in some undeveloped or wartorn nations, we should be OK with it continuing to be terrible here in one of the richest nations in the world, even though it doesn't have to be?

The argument is 1) there is no common definition of what is acceptable, globally it depends on our current living standard hence ultimately the society's level of development 2) on an individual level some would not make the same choices as you so it is ridiculous for you to make judgments on behalf of others 3) if we had implemented those kind of laws earlier, either everybody was forbidden of improving its conditions and freely shop for employers, there would have been enormous inflation (see Venezuela), or the laws wouldn't have been followed at all (most probable).

  we should be OK with it continuing to be terrible

The fact is that most poor people right now are better off than two centuries ago ; so your adjective "terrible" is relative. In 200 years from now, maybe not having its own personal spaceship will be deemed "terrible" by some ;)

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#299

Post by joezydeco » Tue, Oct 02, 2018, 2:43 PM UTC

prolikewh0a wrote: post #232

zacharytelschow wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> turning your employees into welfare-dependent wage-slaves I wasn't aware staying with a particular employer was compulsory.

You're out of touch with the job market and reality itself. It's not easy for these people to just "get a new job". They get paid minimum wage and are probably living paycheck to paycheck. If these people just "move jobs", they're out a paycheck for weeks and may lose their car, their home, not be able to eat, etc.

It's also hard to interview for another job when you're working and if you're not, the bias kicks in when you tell them you're currently out of work.

Salaried people sometimes forget that this is a luxury that's afforded only to them.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#300

Post by ttoinou » Tue, Oct 02, 2018, 2:44 PM UTC

turtlecloud wrote: post #296

ttoinou wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that they should be paid one million dollars each month, because why not, and creating inflation is always good for the economy

You poor soul. You actually think paying workers more creates inflation You obviously haven’t heard of bankers, the federal reserve, and quantitative easing.

Yes they do control and inflate the money supply. So what ? both are happening at the same time