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The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

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Re: The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

#291

Post by epalmer »

sixdimensional wrote: post #288
epalmer wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A masters in Library Science or equivalent is almost always required. Typically (from my casual research) people are hired that have other prior library experience and can show a lifelong love of books. New masters degrees (master in information science at Fla State for example) have an ability to have more exposure to UI design, media creation, digital metadata and more.

That's interesting. I have exactly that degree (MIS), yet, the perception of my education has been much more technical / information systems. Most of the library folk I've spoken to said that information science today really isn't the same as library science and sort of discounted it. I'm not sure if that's some kind of bias that people like me are seen as being overqualified to be a librarian and therefore not consi…

Gosh, I'm sorry to hear that. I hope that does not work that way for my daughter. Her UG college library staff recommended Fla State for the MIS which used to be a MLS degree. She hopes to move from local government libraries to academic in the next several years.

I hope you find the employment you are looking for. And I hope she does as well.

Re: The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

#292

Post by SmellTheGlove »

geebee wrote: post #12

I'm largely in agreement with this Vox piece, but I think there's much more to say in defense of libraries as well. I have a friend who found a red envelope with some money in it in a book that he'd checked out of the library. He figured it belonged to whoever had checked the book out earlier, so he went into the branch and mentioned it. They said that they could find out the last person to read the book, but no more…

Total agreement. Libraries are a public good. Any disruption is going to be at least partial privatization. If it's going to remain free for the end user and not funded from public dollars, the public just became the product (to harp on that meme).

Re: The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

#293

Post by yontherubicon »

I must say I'm rather dissappointed in the writing quality of someone who purports to be an MFA candidate in Creative NonFiction. Though this may be more the fault of the blogstyle medium than antyhing else.

It is still better than the middle-school level writing of the editorial the author is responding to.

As for the points made therein, I'm a bit disgusted. The library was conceived as a place for anyone to go to elevate himself by learning. It is meant for a kind of public education. It is not a homeless shelter. Miss Oliver's claim that the library must exist to shelter the low detracts from it's original purpose, to educate the young and old.

Furthermore, Miss Oliver's argument, that we should keep the libraries for the homeless and the addicts jettisons the role of the library as a community center. How can one be comfortable leaving their children at a library when 75% of the patrons are current/former addicts and or homeless?

I love libraries. I grew up in them. I don't think Amazon should replace them (though I do think Amazon would do well to sponsor them, utilizing their distribution channels, repository of ebooks, and even publishing library editions via their print-on-demand services). However, Miss Olivers essay is more an argument to end libraries rather than to save them.

Re: The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

#294

Post by greggman »

geebee wrote: post #12

I'm largely in agreement with this Vox piece, but I think there's much more to say in defense of libraries as well. I have a friend who found a red envelope with some money in it in a book that he'd checked out of the library. He figured it belonged to whoever had checked the book out earlier, so he went into the branch and mentioned it. They said that they could find out the last person to read the book, but no more…

I haven't been to a library in 30 years or so but it used to be that the list of people who borrowed the book were written in a piece of paper in the book itself.

So yes, I can imagine when it was normal to be able to know who borrowed a book last.

This was also common in Japan as it's important to the plot of the movie "Whispers of the Heart" (English title)

Re: The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

#295

Post by bobthepanda »

Spooky23 wrote: post #238
st1ck wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No libraries would never be invented today. Would you count Project Gutenberg, archive.org or SciHub? I'd also add Bittorrent and other p2p networks as media libraries. I bet there is plenty of lesser known archives like http://web.textfiles.com/

Why are you on HN? All of the information, all of the facts discussed here can be found places like Gutenberg, SciHub and archive.org. But what you get on HN is curation, and a community of like minded people. The library is that in physical form, available to everyone.

More importantly, the library doesn't have an access fee. Computers and phones cost a nonzero amount of money; decent internet access, if available, can also be pretty pricey for people living check to check or worse.

Re: The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

#296

Post by bobthepanda »

kasey_junk wrote: post #264
bobthepanda wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their messaging certainly doesn't discourage the behavior: https://littlefreelibrary.org/about/ In the face of funding declines for libraries, it also doesn't seem very ridiculous for someone to suggest. https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2016/04/ameri...

Wait nothing about that Atlantic article suggests people are funding libraries less because of book boxes? I'd be shocked if there was a correlation there (I'm not at all shocked by the correlation with book boxes and affluent neighborhoods). Also as an aside, if you are thinking about doing a book box there is no need to give the littlefreelibrary organization money. You can just put one up.

It becomes another quiver in the arguments of small-government zealots. Why do we need social services when good Christians donate to charity? Why do we need public transit when Lyft and Uber are here to save the day?

A more pertinent link: https://americanlibrariesmagazine.org/2018/01/02/question-li...

> But Hale and Schmidt point to at least one place where Little Free Libraries are seen as a substitute for true public library services. When budget cuts caused the El Paso (Tex.) Public Library to implement a $50 annual fee for nonresidents to use the library system, the tiny town of nearby Vinton came up with a plan: five Little Free Libraries spread around the community. The town would build them, and keeping them stocked with books would be up to the people of Vinton themselves.

> When Detroit Public Library (DPL) closed its Gabriel Richard branch in 2011, 4th graders at a local elementary school installed a colorful painted bookcase and a sign reading “Outdoor Library” in front of the shuttered building. It was one of four libraries to close that year—two have since reopened, though only two to three days a week.

Re: The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

#297

Post by krapp »

defen wrote: post #249
Spooky23 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We live in a fundamentally broken society today where rent-seekers want to break it further. No libraries would never be invented today. People like Carnegie who thrived in the industrial revolution recognized that and understood that education and social evolution was the path to prosperity and peace. When he studied recent history in his day, he probably pondered the decades of chaos and suffering kicked off by the…

> No libraries would never be invented today. If libraries didn't already exist, I can't imagine the copyright lobby allowing them to be invented.

>If libraries didn't already exist, I can't imagine the copyright lobby allowing them to be invented.

Libraries legally own the material they lend out, and have the legal right to lend it. They exist because of copyright law, not in spite of it.

And if the "copyright lobby" (whatever that is) was so powerful, there are any number of things they could have stopped, like VCRs or photocopiers or even the internet itself.

Re: The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

#298

Post by yontherubicon »

Sharlin wrote: post #130
EliRivers wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now information can be available almost literally for free and instantly Brilliant. I foolishly bought some books recently. Where can I read them for free instead, apart from the library? Is this going to involve piracy? I'm not sure I'm really into that.

It baffles me that people seem to regard ”information” as something fungible, as if blogs and social media and clickbait ”news” could magically substitute for a specific novel or textbook I’d like to read.

Agreed, Library Genesis and IPFS simply haven't advanced that far.

I'd love to see digital archives of all the books ever written, but we're not there yet.

Nevermind the fact that reading a physical book avoids much of the issues with blue light that screens produce

Re: The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

#299

Post by [deleted] »

l9k wrote: post #141
sidlls wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Free (except for the cost of bandwidth/internet access, including devices), instantly (unless internet service is poor or inconsistent or both), and anywhere (that has internet access), you mean. There's nothing improved about the argument, it's just obfuscated better.

Compare internet to library: Free: Transportation to go to your library (2x train ticket, or car + gas): minimum ~$5 / day so $60 a month, plus library card if not free Instantly: ~30 minutes to go, 30 minutes to get back home, depending on where you live. Worst internet connection need a few seconds. Anywhere: you have to physically go to the one library and hope you find the book you're looking for. Nowadays you ha…

[deleted]

Re: The last thing libraries need is Silicon Valley “disruption.”

#300

Post by ekphrasis »

BurningFrog wrote: post #26
Sharlin wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Last time I read a library-related discussion on HN, one of the sentiments expressed was basically ”I download ebooks, why would anyone need a library?” Boggles the mind. There was also a bizarre comment about libraries being only funded to keep a bunch of otherwise useless civil servants employed.

Let me steelman that argument. Libraries were invented because information was only available on printed (or hand written) books, which were very expensive and scarce resources. Now information can be available almost literally for free and instantly, to anywhere. If the institutional inertia of libraries didn't exist today, would they really be invented as they are? https://wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Steel_man

Well, can you say how they actually are invented today?

Please be aware of the distinction between public libraries (as is the general semantic implication when speaking of ”libraries”) serving the whole of the public; national libraries serving the whole of the public, creating systems for the retrieval of information and preserving the cultural memory of the world together with museums and archives; school libraries serving childrens’ and youths’ education; research libraries serving students, scientists, researchers and professionals in, for example, law, medicine, health sciences, industrial research on conducting research, referencing and preserving research data; hospital libraries serving the physically and mentally ill and disabled; and special libraries serving domain-based interests of for example artists, industry professionals and cultural institutions.

Also be aware of the fact that Library and Information Science as a scientific multidisciplinary field researches topics such as information theory, machine learning, cultural heritage, sociology, linguistics, comparative literature, knowledge organization, information retrieval, computer science, pedagogy, critical theory, didactics.

I also suggest a systematic literature study on the term ”information literacy”.

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