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China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

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Re: China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

#291

Post by doktrin »

robotmay wrote: post #112
doktrin wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I hold many assets in this space including ETH and NEO. There are tons of scams and money grabs with ICOs. Case in point, NEO is probably one of the scammiest so-called "crypto" offerings out there

How so? It has a lot of ties to industry already, good development, and plenty of evidence of delivering on their roadmap. That's already better than most crypto-currencies.

> It has a lot of ties to industry already

Like what? Every partnership or "tie" that I've ever heard of ends up being a rumor bordering on outright falsehood - like Microsoft (x2). 2 out of 3 ICOs they had announced prior to the ban ended up being delayed by 6 months or more, quite likely due to platform immaturity.

> good development

For an alpha / early stage crypto project, maybe. However they lack all the features that NEO actually brags about and the codebase is an untestable C# mess where core modules are more or less opaque to everyone but the main developer. It's a security nightmare waiting to happen, and a usability nightmare in the moment : building & publishing the simplest dapp on the platform is basically a non starter right now.

> plenty of evidence of delivering on their roadmap

Again, like what? The platform doesn't actually do anything yet. It basically consists of a few centralized servers and a centrally mined (and centrally owned) token. They're nowhere close to even delivering on dBFT itself, let alone high-concept stuff like mapping physical goods to a "digital identity".

> That's already better than most crypto-currencies.

Not if you compare it to other "currencies" in anything close to the same price range. Its valuation is far and away driven by clever marketing and uninformed speculation.

Re: China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

#292

Post by nivertech »

girvo wrote: post #223
throwawaybbqed wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What? I can't take 10K from my parents/friends and give them equity?

Don't quote me on this, but there's a specific-ish exemption for family/friends if I recall correctly.

there are specific exemptions for family, for friends and for fools ;)

Re: China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

#293

Post by empath75 »

rothbardrand wrote: post #147

Why don't rich people need protection? Here's the answer: this is their protection. It reduces their competition. Seriously, these securities rules keep people like me from investing in AirBnB and Uber (two that I caught very early and wanted into)... but we can all go to Vegas and lose $100k in a single weekend. But putting $10k into Uber's seed round is somehow a crime I need to be protected from? Truth of the matt…

Name one ICO that is a legitimate business.

Re: China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

#294

Post by vasilipupkin »

rothbardrand wrote: post #228
TrevorAustin wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It ... sounds like you wouldn't have any trouble getting accredited?

Lets assume I am accredited. This isn't about me getting mine. This is about the fact that the regulations deny you a chance to join me.

they do not. crowdfunding from non accredited investors is already allowed.

http://www.investopedia.com/articles/entrepreneurship-small-...

Re: China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

#295

Post by goptimize »

elefanten wrote: post #256
rothbardrand wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those "studies" are self serving. That is the political propaganda keeping you feeling safe in having your rights violated. This isn't a question of flavor of politics- but fundamental rights. Do you have freedom of association or not? Secondly, you think its "fairly clear to [you]" that these ICOs are scams. I am sure some are, but I know for a fact that many are not. I am quite capable of telling the difference (as…

One of your key premises, that investing in startups is a key / good path to getting rich, is flawed. Investing in startups is notoriously NOT that stable of an investment vehicle. If you're a small-scale enough investor to not meet accreditation rules, why would you WANT to throw 10k at a startup? You speak in terms of rights and that's one debate to have. But evaluating the material harm in this situation, the noti…

"One of your key premises, that investing in startups is a key / good path to getting rich, is flawed" - straw man argument

Re: China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

#296

Post by vasilipupkin »

empath75 wrote: post #293
rothbardrand wrote: post #147

Why don't rich people need protection? Here's the answer: this is their protection. It reduces their competition. Seriously, these securities rules keep people like me from investing in AirBnB and Uber (two that I caught very early and wanted into)... but we can all go to Vegas and lose $100k in a single weekend. But putting $10k into Uber's seed round is somehow a crime I need to be protected from? Truth of the matt…

Name one ICO that is a legitimate business.

most ICOs are done by startups that haven't built their businesses yet - that's why they are raising money. Many of them seem like legitimate businesses that could fail but also could succeed.

Re: China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

#297

Post by mrep »

felipeko wrote: post #252
dsacco wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People cheering a government's ban on what its citizens can do with their lawfully earned money. Are you okay with laws about how money is earned? Why? If yes, why are you not okay with laws about how money is spent? There are a vast number of regulations imposed on how you spend your money is spent in any government. Do you categorically disagree with them or are you okay with some of them? EDIT: Every time a thre…

The principle is pretty simple, if it's two consenting adults doing something that does not impact a third person rights, they should be allowed to do it. So I would be okay with laws about how money is earned, if there's a third person being impacted (pollution, for example), and i am okay with laws about how money is spent if there's a third person being impacted (idk, hiring a assassin) Of course when one of the t…

Except scams and bubbles cause negative externalities [1] such as systematic risk [2] so they do impact other people.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Externality#Negative

[2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Systemic_risk

Re: China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

#298

Post by uberrr »

vasilipupkin wrote: post #296
empath75 wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Name one ICO that is a legitimate business.

most ICOs are done by startups that haven't built their businesses yet - that's why they are raising money. Many of them seem like legitimate businesses that could fail but also could succeed.

So you can't name a single legitimate business that's doing an ico?

Re: China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

#299

Post by burger_moon »

robotmay wrote: post #112
doktrin wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I hold many assets in this space including ETH and NEO. There are tons of scams and money grabs with ICOs. Case in point, NEO is probably one of the scammiest so-called "crypto" offerings out there

How so? It has a lot of ties to industry already, good development, and plenty of evidence of delivering on their roadmap. That's already better than most crypto-currencies.

Is their website neo.org? Because that website won't load for me after about 5 minutes. Not exactly inspiring a lot of trust for someone who wants to learn about them.

Re: China's Central Bank Bans ICOs

#300

Post by [deleted] »

Jedi72 wrote: post #12
bertil wrote: post #8

It probably has a lot more to do with the country regulating its own fiat currency, foreign change and savings quite aggressively. That made any previously unregulated (because new) alternative the _de facto_ change mechanism.

This is one of the things about bitcoin nobody has ever explained to me adequately. Governments use monetary policy & other economic tools to regulate the economy. Assuming we're all Keynsians here, this is a pretty important feature that govts will not give up, so how is Bitcoin ever supposed to supplant fiat currency?

[deleted]
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