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Ask HN: Have you ever thought of leaving programming for something else?

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Re: Ask HN: Have you ever thought of leaving programming for something else?

#291

Post by ajosh »

thecatspaw wrote: post #221
gandolfinmyhead wrote: post #143

Sadly yes. It's been very frustrating at times. I thought of becoming an environment artist for videogames instead. Though OP hasn't asked for the following here goes, I feel the IT field has a lot of people wanting to change career paths, more than any other field because of the following: 1. Programming is an art, if not done right and assuming the product is in continuous development, will come back to bite you in…

> 3. The IT field has no concept of overtime pay this very much depends on the location. The US seems to be lax on overtime laws, whereas in europe its more strictly defined, and I have not worked for any company in europe where we didnt get overtime pay/compensation

The US is actually very strict with a variety of penalties for companies that violate the law regarding overtime. The amount of overtime pay and the hours at which it starts are clearly defined.

There are, however, some exemptions for some occupations. Computer professionals, farmers workers, artists, professions (i.e. doctors and lawyers) and managers are all exempt.

It's debatable which professions should remain on this list but the law is reasonably strict with respect to over time pay.

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever thought of leaving programming for something else?

#292

Post by cyberferret »

oneeyedpigeon wrote: post #183
cyberferret wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's an Asperger profession; smart but artless. Sorry, but I would have to disagree with you on this. I've been programming now for over 35 years, and really cannot see myself doing anything else. I find I can channel my creativity into programming in many ways, and writing a good piece of code gives me the same satisfaction as writing or recording apiece of music. Yes, I am a musician too, and while they are very…

> physio ... rubbing shoulders I see what you did there :)

LOL...touche!

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever thought of leaving programming for something else?

#294

Post by JaumeGreen »

gcatalfamo wrote: post #251
truth_sentinell wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could save money from your programming job and fund yourself a dancing academy. Or even better, find a way to mix the two. Never stop dreaming!

I'm sorry but dancing is definitely not one of those professions where "if you believe you can do it". Depending on the specific dancing style there are strict body types and features that you need to have, and not all of them can be acquired by training. So yeah, nature is not fair but feel-good comedies don't always apply to real life.

You have it right.

Others have pointed to you that to dance you only need to be able to move, to that I agree. But between dancing and have a profession out of dancing there's a big difference.

There are lots of reason why now I can't base my income in dancing, I'm telling them as to give a data point as to why it's not allways as easy as "if you want you can".

First: I don't live alone anymore. Married with some obligations. My income needs have grown, even though there are two sources of income.

Second: Physical activities require discipline, that I lack, and time, which is now spent on my "new" job, my partner and housework.

Third: There are several possible incomes for dancing. None of them make the cut as a great source of income. * Payed exhibition dancing is usually done by younger and more talented people, also it's inconsistent income. Done a bit, enough not to find it feasible. * Competitions don't pay that much, lots of politics in there. * Teaching (which is what I love) doesn't pay much unless you have a name, with low salary you'd need lots of classes, but names teachers get most of them. * Staff work pays less than teaching, necessary for the school to function, but boring.

Fourth: compatible schedules. Being with someone that lives in "the real world" means that working 15 to 23/24 is not seeing them (staff+classes+parties). That and money where the primary causes for my change of career. Priorities matter.

Fifth: People tend to prefer tall, fit, young, handsome male dancers and short, fit, young, beatiful female dancers. Each point where you diverge it's a handicap, I have several.

So yes, I could have kept on my dream job, but I would have to leave behind too many things that I need, like my SO, and would have to go back to living with flatmates. All that, in my early 40's, is not what I want of my life.

"Never stop dreaming!", "if you believe you can do it" are nice phrases to throw at people, but you can cause them to lose their grounding in reality, where sometimes dreams have to be crushed for the greatest good.

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever thought of leaving programming for something else?

#295

Post by rfrey »

raverbashing wrote: post #275
truth_sentinell wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless you're severely handicapped, I don't understand why wouldn't you be able to dance whatever type of dance you want. If you have all your limbs and can walk, you can perfectly dance whatever is that you want. If you're fat and can't dance no more that one minute without getting out of breath, get in shape and train endurance. As simple as that. If you're 5.4" or less and feel intimidated dancing with a taller wo…

> If you're fat and can't dance no more that one minute without getting out of breath, get in shape and train endurance. As simple as that. If you think that all it takes for dancing is "not getting out of breath" then I can see why you would think "anyone can do it"

I dunno but I think you guys might be talking past each other a bit - this discussion is different depending on whether "dancing" is ballroom dancing, e.g. or ballet, modern, or what have you.

Although even with modern, there is a strong school aiming to democratize dance. My family were performers in Kaeja D'Dance (http://www.kaeja.org/) Porch View Dances this year (look it up if you like dance) and the performances were very good. The choreographers were very careful to work around body types and capabilities.

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever thought of leaving programming for something else?

#296

Post by _k5mx »

xchaotic wrote: post #286
triplesec wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's too late? I'm certain you could work in other kinds of development

I bet the OP can make loads more money in VFX than going back and doing some junior programming role, hence I'm with him.

I would question the word "loads" ;] Sups are usually earning around 150-200 CAD p/y, seniors 100-130. I may be wrong with the numbers though.

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever thought of leaving programming for something else?

#297

Post by _k5mx »

triplesec wrote: post #276
_k5mx wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I have an opposite problem. I work in a different industry, but completely adore programming and solving variety of problems that involve data processing or connecting various systems together.

What's too late? I'm certain you could work in other kinds of development

I can, but it does mean starting from scratch.

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever thought of leaving programming for something else?

#298

Post by cyberferret »

perlpimp wrote: post #247
cyberferret wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's an Asperger profession; smart but artless. Sorry, but I would have to disagree with you on this. I've been programming now for over 35 years, and really cannot see myself doing anything else. I find I can channel my creativity into programming in many ways, and writing a good piece of code gives me the same satisfaction as writing or recording apiece of music. Yes, I am a musician too, and while they are very…

remark on a tangent - before siting down to a bunch of tasks I ask myself how I can make this funny/creative, how is it hilarious and how interesting can this be made. suddenly perspective changes.

Exactly. It's about reframing the task so that it goes from tedious to fun. I know it is an old and probably out of fashion book now, but I really think a lot of people who feel stuck in dead end jobs should read Fish! by Stephen Lundin [0]

To reframe this from the 'musician' side of my life, a lot of other guitarists I play with absolutely hate changing the strings on their guitars. They treat it like a chore to be avoided and rushed through only when really needed.

But a few years ago, I read a short story about how Samurai warriors used to care and polish their sword blades on a regular basis. I was entranced by the ritual and ceremony around this mundane process, so I set up a similar process around my guitar string changes. Now I actually look forward to doing string changes, as it give me a lot of meditative time to bond and learn more about my instruments and my music.

[0] - http://www.fishphilosophy.com/

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever thought of leaving programming for something else?

#299

Post by barbs »

clentaminator wrote: post #256

I think about leaving programming every day. I love programming, but I'm not sure I enjoy software development as a career. I enjoy coding and understanding how computer systems work, but I don't care for the constant changes in tools and techniques in certain domains of development. I'd rather practise with and improve my existing knowledge of a subject, instead of constantly playing catch-up with someone else's too…

I'm in an eerily similar situation. Been doing software development for about 5 years (though at different places, doing primarily Android development), am just over 6 weeks at a new job and I'm beginning to feel that software development's just not for me anymore. I don't feel passionate about most aspects of it - constantly playing catchup with the latest frameworks, the development/management methodologies/processes, wrestling with the Android framework, pushing pixels, UI/UX...

There are still elements that I enjoy. I still love the creative, mathematical problem-solving aspects, but those moments feel few and far between.

I also feel at times I'm taking my position for granted - I'm not sure what else I'd do besides programming. I've always had a casual interest in security, so I'm thinking I might look into that. Being a "bug bounty-hunter" seems like a dream, though I'm not entirely sure how realistic that would be!

I also love music, but I think that's even less feasible. I'm not proficient enough to be able to teach it. But I would like to be able to dedicate more time to learning/producing it.

Good luck - here's hoping we find something more fulfilling :).

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever thought of leaving programming for something else?

#300

Post by rfrey »

throwanem wrote: post #261
gandolfinmyhead wrote: post #143

Sadly yes. It's been very frustrating at times. I thought of becoming an environment artist for videogames instead. Though OP hasn't asked for the following here goes, I feel the IT field has a lot of people wanting to change career paths, more than any other field because of the following: 1. Programming is an art, if not done right and assuming the product is in continuous development, will come back to bite you in…

Points 1 and 2 can be a good thing, if you have the mental fortitude and cast-iron gullet to specialize in cleaning up other people's messes. There's a lot of money to be made that way. It doesn't tickle the artistic urge the same way greenfield development often can, but that's what creative hobbies are for - I write - and you can derive considerable satisfaction from the knowledge that you're bringing order from ch…

This is surprising and interesting... how do companies who do not value quality when the code is first written come to value quality later?

I'd expect a pattern where the original thrower-of-spaghetti-against-the-wall has left, and management assumes the later devs - who can't go as fast, or get more bugs because of the holy mess of the codebase - are just not as good as the first guy.

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