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A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

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Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#281

Post by verisimi »

runjake wrote: post #160
nostromo wrote: post #72

I think this is just the new normal. My car was stolen in Seattle and it was found with the person driving it when he was pulled over by police. In the car he had paperwork with his name on it, a weapon, and his work uniform in the trunk with a name badge (he was a security guard - lol) along with a neighborhood witness. Despite a mountain of evidence, the prosecutors declined to press charges because without direct…

If you're wondering what is being discussed in the meetings about whether or not more surveillance should be deployed, at the city and county levels, this is it. Crime isn't being prosecuted, the criminals know it, and this breeds more crime (and more criminals). Even when they are imprisoned and incarcerated, they're probably in jail for somewhere between 24 hours and a few weeks. They know pretty much everyone else…

So you're saying that the government engineers the situation (more crime) in order to justify the solution (more surveillance) that they already intended. Once the surveillance is in place, they would then clear the blockage (start prosecuting crime again) which will be a big win for their solution (more surveillance).

So the whole thing is actually about greater control of the law-abiding (not decreasing crime), and how to engineer the circumstances to get the public to accept the unacceptable.

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#282

Post by verisimi »

awesome_dude wrote: post #244
nradov wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crime statistics are on the decline. It's harder to tell whether actual crime is on the decline.

Anecdata isn't going to get us any closer. Statistics gathered the way the are is all we have

But.... you can get statistics on anything you like, if you are prepared to fund (or defund) them. If you pay to see the relation between crime and how many cats there are in a neighbourhood, you can get that! Ie statistics themselves are part of the game.

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#283

Post by com2kid »

saltyoldman wrote: post #114
emptybits wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Appreciate the pushback, saltyoldman. Yes, we want to respond to credible threats. And, as always, courts and law enforcement can invade privacy when there's reason to believe someone is worth surveilling. But we're talking here about widespread, extremely cheap, technically easy surveillance of potentially everyone at all times. That's the endgame that some commercial and government interests have in mind. Would you…

I used to be that way. However more recently I have come to prefer security over privacy, at least where I live. I do want to make sure human, drug and weapon traffickers are not exiting off my freeway ramp. I do get the issues with what you're saying, but let's think of ways to have both. The existence of a surveillance net with safegards. In other words yes let's have the conversation to make our country secure and…

I'm in Seattle and everyone knows exactly where human trafficking is happening and the police are doing nothing about it. Teenagers are being pimped out all along Aurora and literally nothing is happening despite literally years of public outcry.

The pimps get arrested again and again and then released without charges being filed.

Cameras aren't going to make a difference.

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#284

Post by awesome_dude »

verisimi wrote: post #282
awesome_dude wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdata isn't going to get us any closer. Statistics gathered the way the are is all we have

But.... you can get statistics on anything you like, if you are prepared to fund (or defund) them. If you pay to see the relation between crime and how many cats there are in a neighbourhood, you can get that! Ie statistics themselves are part of the game.

So, we believe nothing?

Or, we demand evidence that what you assert about this set of statistics is accurate

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#285

Post by nixae »

throwaway173738 wrote: post #199
runjake wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not qualified to answer, but I regularly hear the following in the US: - Not enough (LE|DA|jail) funding or staffing or space. - "We want to focus on violent crimes". I have a whole rant about this, watching violent criminals/rapists going through revolving doors. - Use of diversion and "restorative justice" programs, which clearly do not work for certain classes of criminals with very long rap sheets, but here w…

> Use of diversion and "restorative justice" programs, which clearly do not work for certain classes of criminals with very long rap sheets, but here we are. But they clearly work on others, so they’re probably fine. > Not enough (LE|DA|jail) funding or staffing or space This is a solvable problem if you’re willing to pay taxes on it. I think it’s a good thing because newer facilities and more staff probably leads to…

[flagged]

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#286

Post by warumdarum »

emodendroket wrote: post #277
jeffbee wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm just wondering why this Wild West stuff seems to be neither effective, since Texas has auto theft rates well above national averages, nor necessary, considering that Florida lacks the statute and has auto theft rates well below national averages.

It doesn't work but it does let people fantasize about being allowed to shoot someone to death legally.

Well there are working alternatives to that:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_El_Salvador

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#287

Post by toast0 »

BobbyTables2 wrote: post #273
toast0 wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My brother bought a stolen motorcycle once. He checked with California DMV before purchasing it, and IIRC, the DMV issued him a title. Several months later, the local PD came over, asked him a lot of questions, took the motorcycle and let him go. Of course, he couldn't get in touch with the seller again, so he was just out the money. Stolen property doesn't come with a sticker indicating it's stolen.

How did that happen? The thieves stole the car, got a replacement title, and then officially transferred it to your brother? I’ve bought and sold a couple of cars when I was younger and more foolish. Not even sure had contracts, just remember an exchange of cashier check and signed title, followed with a form to the state that the vehicle was purchased. Man, never going to do that again!

I guess yeah. I never heard about it again, after the PD picked up the bike.

Maybe there's a stolen vehicle registry to check now... If it wasn't stolen recently, anyway.

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#289

Post by iberator »

loeg wrote: post #253
hsbauauvhabzb wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Major ish news /where you live/. Not globally.

Hacker News, a forum run by an American tech incubator headquartered in SF... (I don't even live in California.) None of that really explains away your leap to incorrect conclusions and failure to apologize.

except this guy is right.

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#290

Post by bombcar »

jeffbee wrote: post #168
warumdarum wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, texas gets all that borderly goodness the liberal north dishes out so freely, but avoids for itself ?

I'm just wondering why this Wild West stuff seems to be neither effective, since Texas has auto theft rates well above national averages, nor necessary, considering that Florida lacks the statute and has auto theft rates well below national averages.

Florida is surrounded by ocean and you can’t drive stolen cars to Cuba.

Texas is bordered by Mexico and you can drive stolen cars to Mexico.

Also if we’re talking gundefend shouldn’t we be comparing carjacking stats?

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