Live data from Hacker News

AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

axelk.ee

281–290 of 783 posts

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#281
post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rather: composes (or: re-sequences). Synthesis requires reason and essential capabilities, like an empirical a priori judgement. Without concepts, meaning or imagination, there's no synthesis.

The point is that the AI inferencing is equivalent to a person reading half a dozen separate papers, comprhending the basic concepts of each, relating them together into a mental model of the topic, and then writing an essay that summarizes the basic points. The person isn't plagiarizing anything here, but engaging in research, understanding, and synthesis of various sources of information. The person absolutely does…

I'm afraid, the essence is that is not. Re-sequencing content is not the same as synthesis and therefore not the same as a person processing information and communicating their own conception of this. There's a vital difference.

(We can even observe this in the resulting text: we immediately grasp the level of competence of the author, just by the way they take their path trough and at the matter. With LLMs, well, there's this even temperature, ready-made feeling, regulated by probability thresholds and RLHF sanctioned phrasing, also known as "slop" – even rhythmic intensifications, like "not this, not that, but…", which is actually a figure for a synthetic construct, don't help –, since the text isn't the trace or product of an actual organized thought – or, at least, an attempt at an organized thought.)

PS: "empirical a priori judgement" was meant as translation of synthetisches Urteil a priori (Kant). I.e., our ability to mentally prove concepts like congruency, which are not a priori, but can be inferred without regression to empirical knowledge. Typically, this requires both our inner sense (time, sequence, etc.) and outer senses (space, configuration, etc.)

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#282
post #252
post #171

if theres just one good thing coming out of ai its breaking copyright law forever. no one should be able to "own" ideas. royalties for commercial use is another thing and i support it but what we know as (non commercial) piracy and unlicensed fan art should be 100% legal

Then go ahead and abolish copyright for everyone. Instead we're stuck in an even worse system where the hypercorporations gleefully plagiarize everyone else while sending SWAT teams to kill anyone who pirates a movie.

Jesus is just an uncopyrighted Mickey Mouse if you have no morals. People have been abusing that fact for a long time and have made some pretty abhorrent products.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ownership is entirely a legal concept. Violating it in any form, intellectual or otherwise, is generally free.

I strongly disagree. Copying is fundamentally different than taking because the original source still retains their data. Copying cannot be categorized as theft in any sane society.

Ok, well it isn't in the US. Theft and copyright violations are entirely distinct laws here.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#284
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When did the last original thought happen then? Clearly thoughts must have been original at some point, or there wouldn't be any at all

Technically one of {Newton, Leibniz} was first, but you're missing GP's point

No, I think I just find it reductive. The fact that some ideas are independently thought by multiple people does not feel like a compelling argument for normalizing copying someone else's work verbatim and trying to pass it off as your own.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#286
post #252
post #171

if theres just one good thing coming out of ai its breaking copyright law forever. no one should be able to "own" ideas. royalties for commercial use is another thing and i support it but what we know as (non commercial) piracy and unlicensed fan art should be 100% legal

Then go ahead and abolish copyright for everyone. Instead we're stuck in an even worse system where the hypercorporations gleefully plagiarize everyone else while sending SWAT teams to kill anyone who pirates a movie.

Obviously there's an ideal middle ground, but what LLMs do is allow free transfer of knowledge while still (mostly) preserving the protections that copyright should be protecting. For example, I can have an LLM give me the entire plot of a book (which is fine), but it won't spit out an exact copy of the book.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#287
The war on copying is like the war on drugs: unwinnable, and socially useless.

Let information be free for personal and recreational uses[0], and vote for governments that will fund the arts. The corporations will be just fine.

[0] The AI companies and big tech vs publishers, music labels, etc. can fight to the death in the courts over who owes who what, for all I care.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's never been a problem with people ad-blocking for the last 20 years, why is it suddenly a problem now? We've been celebrating denying creators revenue for decades... Maybe this is just the internet hypocricy of "When I do it, it's good, when they do it, it's bad".

Total sleight of hand. Ad blocking has always been a problem for creators but it's aimed at big corps - non-creators. The creators asked people to support them other ways or turn off the blocking. And it's not like the little independent creators wanted this version of commercialized internet in the first place. The ai marketing teams are spinning everything they can but no AI companies are the conscript, the vulture…

The conversion from viewer to donator is around 1%. This is true from wikipedia, to twitch, to podcasts.

The number of people who will not ever load your ads is around 30%.

I can tell you that creators talk about this a lot in private, but will not publicly because the internet has a mass delusion on how creation and compensation works. It's like trying to convince christians that jesus obviously didn't come back from the dead days later, depsite there being no logical system available that would explain it.

If we were to try and map out a functional internet where everyone wins, users and creators, there is no example where ad blocking is anything other net harmful. You either get volunteer net where 0.01% share hobby posts on their own dime for the other 99.9% or you get IRC where 99% of the population doesn't really benefit (ala 1993).

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#289
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People also got blown up before atomic bombs, but it's hard to argue that they weren't worth treating more seriously than a stick of dynamite. Sometimes being able to do something at a massively larger scale is a meaningful difference.

You transmitted the same concept I tried to transmit, but without falling into Godwin's Law :)

I was actually worried that I was so close to it because of the obvious relevancy to WWII that people might object to my analogy, so I found it amusing to read yours immediately after I submitted mine!

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#290
post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the past three months I've shipped more code than I have in years. New php extension https://github.com/hparadiz/ext-gnu-grep A Demo showing how to stream webrtc to KDE Wayland overlay. https://github.com/hparadiz/camera-notif A fun little tool that captures stdout/stderr on any running process. https://github.com/hparadiz/bpf_write_monitor Then I upgraded my 10 year old hand written framework to a new version tha…

Task manager seems fun. In your screenshot, are your two task manager instances using a GB of ram?

Without the milk drop plugin it's stable around 175 with all the other plugins. With no plugins it's about 80 mb at idle but the memory usage is higher if there's more processes running.
Post reply on HN