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Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

reuters.com

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Re: Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

#281

Post by IncreasePosts »

sjsdaiuasgdia wrote: post #247
IncreasePosts wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know a lot of people who love to quote Smedley and Eisenhower's farewell address, and to a person they support military intervention in Ukraine. Also, people who unironically were saying "The USA shouldn't be the world police!" 10 years ago.

It's almost like supporting an ally whose sovereign territory is being violated is some kind of different situation than the US unilaterally performing military actions in a variety of locations. Amazing!

Wasn't every gun and rocket given to Ukraine a theft from the hungry and the cold?

Re: Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

#282

Post by AStrangeMorrow »

callamdelaney wrote: post #64

Now the UK should swiftly follow suit in sacking these cowboys. The taxpayer is being charged extortionate rates in some cases for fresh graduates who know effectively nothing at all about what they talk about. At the same time, we should increase salary banding for technical roles to the market rate. We will get the experience we need for much, much less.

Yeah. Also might be a bias from my school, but for the software engineering specialty, in average the worse a student was performing the more likely they’d end up working for a consulting company after graduation. A few exceptions (student with a goal of moving into management positions) but none of the students that were either very good or passionate are working in the consulting world now. I am sure there are some skilled consultants, and these companies have their use, but I am always shocked to see how much governments spend on them.

Re: Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

#283

Post by mellosouls »

leguminous wrote: post #279
heisenbit wrote: post #217

Consultants are misused if employed on a constant basis instead of employing enough senior staff directly. There are well known drivers on both sides that tend to promote such an unhealthy setup. What is concerning at the US government is not cutting consulting but at the same time cutting staff and on top creating a hostile environment for senior staff. This is unprecedented and is not something one would do in the…

Part of the reason the US government needs to use consultants is because they can't actually pay enough to hire senior developers directly due to the constraints imposed by the GS pay scales. Often times the top levels of the pay scale aren't even available because there is some rule about how people can't be paid more than someone else. So instead they pay for consultants and all of their overhead. (Of course there…

They still don't generally need to use consultants. Even at the poor rates of pay in many government teams, there are still some decent technical staff who don't just chase the dollar. Bear in mind the salary standard is normal market, not FAANG/SV.

Consultants are nearly always used so that managers can say "we went with BigCo, its their fault" when things go wrong.

ie. they are generally a political choice rather than technical.

Re: Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

#284

Post by mediaman »

whimsicalism wrote: post #155
sepalous wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. The government could be made hugely more efficient through the use of technology. However, the civil service simply doesn't pay enough to attract the talent it needs. Therefore, we are left with little option but to pay consultants more to deliver these contracts. The total cost to the tax payer is higher; it doesn't make sense! It is reductive to say that we just need to pay more, however. The civil service…

the problem is there is literally no incentive to make sure you are hiring the right people in government. nobody is sacked if you dont make your numbers, xyz. higher salary bands are a neccessary but not sufficient condition to get competent operators.

Agreed. Many people I know who work in state government are always on or planning their next vacation, or in the middle of another home renovation, and lightly joke about their “work from home.”

It’s just incredibly clear that there is no inventive to actually perform, and combined with environments such as WFH that need to be outcomes-based, it starts just looking like a fairytale life paid for by other people.

This happens in the private sector as well, but tends to correct over time - hence big tech’s layoffs, especially of managers and nontechnical staff, after the excesses of 2021-2022.

I don’t think this is true of all state employees, but it seems to happen more with the educated professional class with more abstract work.

Re: Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

#285

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

callamdelaney wrote: post #64

Now the UK should swiftly follow suit in sacking these cowboys. The taxpayer is being charged extortionate rates in some cases for fresh graduates who know effectively nothing at all about what they talk about. At the same time, we should increase salary banding for technical roles to the market rate. We will get the experience we need for much, much less.

Yeah, but that's going to make your spreadsheet look different.

Re: Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

#286

Post by bumby »

whimsicalism wrote: post #249
azemetre wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No you see only capital is allowed to bargain with the government, labor is not allowed to for "reasons" that somehow always seem to benefit capital at their expense.

workers are allowed to bargain against the government, as in “i will not take the job at the pay you are offering.” both private companies and workers should not be allowed to band together to deny the government all contracts until they get the one they want.

Your stance seems to be at odds with the freedom of association protected by the US Constitution.

Re: Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

#287

Post by miltonlost »

CityOfThrowaway wrote: post #268
tw04 wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ONLY time this occurs in the private sector is when corporate raiders are trying to extract every last penny from a business they plan on killing. Unsurprisingly this follows directly with project 2025s goal of dismantling the federal government and privatizing what departments aren’t filled with party loyalists at the expense of the average US citizen.

The data on hostile takeovers by "corporate raiders" very much does not support the characterization here. The category of PE firms you're talking about buy companies that are deeply troubled. Generally due to the management's unwillingness to accept reality and make change, the company is heading towards oblivion one way or another. Perhaps surprisingly, the vast majority of takeover targets wind up as net job creat…

> One of my laments is that there is no automatic equivalent force in the government. Agencies grow and grow, projects grow and grow, all totally decoupled from whether they are achieving any progress whatsoever towards the agency's mission.

There was. It's the GAO and the inspectors general of the agencies, both of which have been gutted by this administration.

> I'm not defending the specific actions of this administration (for which I simply don't know enough), but it is refreshing to see the government rummaging through its mess and cutting stuff that is irrational, corrupt, and not serving the mission.

LMAO, you're not defending the specific actions, but you know enough about the actions to know that they are "cutting stuff that is irrational". This is a defense of DOGE but with the "no, i'm NOT defending Musk" veneer that doesn't pass muster. You're giving this administration the benefit of the doubt and a large amount of good faith that they have not earned.

Re: Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

#288

Post by umvi »

ImPostingOnHN wrote: post #280
umvi wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe the federal government needs a reset/dismantling/pruning/whatever you want to call it. With any "normal" president (including Kamala Harris), the federal government would likely be expanding spending and gov't programs right now even though the debt is so huge that interest payments on the debt now eclipse the defense budget, which itself exceeds the next 9 defense budgets in the world combined.

> With any "normal" president (including Kamala Harris), the federal government would likely be expanding spending and gov't programs right now Perhaps, and in such a case, the american economy would not be cratering like it has been lately, and americans would be suffering less, and america would be stronger on the international stage. In fact, all things considered, more spending would have been better for america…

You can't just spend your troubles away forever. It might temporarily alleviate things, but long term it will collapse the entire system. At some point there need to be painful austerity measures - budget cuts, increased taxes, and the like. It's unpopular to do painful things, but it's necessary for survival.

Re: Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

#289

Post by jedberg »

bpodgursky wrote: post #183
jedberg wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Musk's companies fail their audits too. Tesla can't account for $1.4B of government money they received.

Why does this matter? Government either gives loans and demands they are paid back, or pays for deliverables. If you have to keep your fingers in the books to feel good about what's happening, it was a badly structured contract.

Because it's my money and I want to know how it's being spent, whether it's the government or a private company spending it. I had no choice in where that money went, so I need transparency on how it's being spent.

That's why every government contractor has to report what they are doing with their government money.

Re: Pentagon to terminate $5.1B in IT contracts with Accenture, Deloitte

#290

Post by yibg »

ibejoeb wrote: post #21

Kinda amusing that the general sentiment so far, in a forum filled with technology expertise, is that there is certainly waste in these budgets. But, when discussing the overall trend of cutting programs in other fields where the majority doesn't have that expertise, the conclusion is the opposite.

I don't think the majority view is so much there is no waste in the other areas. With most people I talk to, the objection is mostly with the methods employed and the lack of accountability.

For me, I wouldn't have objected to Musk / DOGE going in and actually doing an audit of everything to look for waste, fraud and abuse. And if actual waste, fraud and abuse are found, where evidence and details are provided, I'd personally celebrate that.

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