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How University Students Use Claude

anthropic.com

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Re: How University Students Use Claude

#281

Post by CyLith »

hackyhacky wrote: post #70
kibwen wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The irreducible answer to "why should I" is that it makes you ever-more-increasingly reliant on a teetering tower of fragile and interdependent supply chains furnished by for-profit companies who are all too eager to rake you over the coals to fulfill basic cognitive functions. Like, Socrates may have been against writing because he thought it made your memory weak, but at least I, an individual, am perfectly capable…

> The irreducible answer to "why should I" is that it makes you ever-more-increasingly reliant on a teetering tower of fragile and interdependent supply chains furnished by for-profit companies who are all too eager to rake you over the coals to fulfill basic cognitive functions. Yes, but that horse has long ago left the barn. I don't know how to grow crops, build a house, tend livestock, make clothes, weld metal, bu…

Speak for yourself. Some of us see the difficulty in sustaining and maintaining this fragile technology stack and have decided to do something about it. I may not be able to do all those things but it is worth learning, since there really is no downside for someone who enjoys learning. I am tackling farming and cpu design at the moment and it is tremendously fun.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#282

Post by lgessler »

chenzo44 wrote: post #38

professor here. i set up a website to host openwebui to use in my b-school courses (UG and grad). the only way i've found to get students to stop using it to cheat is to push them to use it until they learn for themselves that it doesn't answer everything correctly. this requires careful thoughtful assignment redesign. everytime i grade a submission with the hallmarks of ai-generation, i always find that it fails to…

Sure, this is a common sentiment, and one that works for some courses. But for others (introductory programming, say) I have a really hard time imagining an assignment that could not be one-shot by an LLM. What can someone with 2 weeks of Python experience do that an LLM couldn't? The other issue is that LLMs are, for now, periodically increasing in their capabilities, so it's anyone's guess whether this is actually a sustainable attitude on the scale of years.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#283

Post by alwa »

jplusequalt wrote: post #184
DrillShopper wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no industry that I have worked in that fights against creating or joining unions tooth, claw, and nail quite like software engineers.

I think more and more workers are warming up to unions. As wages in software continue to be oppressed, I think we'll see an increase in unionization efforts for software engineers.

Software engineer wages? Oppressed? This is work that averages well over 6 figures—for a single worker, for desk work—in the US?

https://www.indeed.com/career/software-engineer/salaries

https://www.levels.fyi/t/software-engineer/locations/united-...

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#284

Post by ifyoubuildit »

hackyhacky wrote: post #70
kibwen wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The irreducible answer to "why should I" is that it makes you ever-more-increasingly reliant on a teetering tower of fragile and interdependent supply chains furnished by for-profit companies who are all too eager to rake you over the coals to fulfill basic cognitive functions. Like, Socrates may have been against writing because he thought it made your memory weak, but at least I, an individual, am perfectly capable…

> The irreducible answer to "why should I" is that it makes you ever-more-increasingly reliant on a teetering tower of fragile and interdependent supply chains furnished by for-profit companies who are all too eager to rake you over the coals to fulfill basic cognitive functions. Yes, but that horse has long ago left the barn. I don't know how to grow crops, build a house, tend livestock, make clothes, weld metal, bu…

Things like this give us enshitification. When the consumer has no understanding of what they're buying, they have to take corporations at their word that new "features" are actually beneficial, when they're mostly beneficial to the seller.

Kind of like how an ignorant electorate makes for a poor democracy, an ignorant consumer base makes for a poor free market.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#285

Post by dullcrisp »

elliotec wrote: post #261
dullcrisp wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what happened to them, I wonder?

Well, they reproduced so we could exist now. Definition of ancestors.

That’s…not what I asked. Y’all need to recognize that Darwinism was intended as an explanatory theory, not as an ethos. And it’s not how we judge building practices.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#286

Post by pxc »

srveale wrote: post #120
hackyhacky wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's called the "Flipped classroom" approach. Flipped classroom is just having the students give lectures, instead of the teacher. > Basically, a student's marks depend mostly (only?) on what they can do in a setting where AI is verifiably unavailable. This is called "proctored exams" and it's been pretty common in universities for a few centuries. None of this addresses the real issue, which is whether teachers sh…

> Flipped classroom is just having the students give lectures, instead of the teacher. Not quite. Flipped classroom means more instruction outside of class time and less homework. > This is called "proctored exams" and it's been pretty common in universities for a few centuries. None of this addresses the real issue Proctored exams is part of it. In-class assignments is another. Asynchronous instruction is another. A…

Flipped classroom sounds horrible to me. I never liked being given time to work on essays or big projects in class. I prefer working at home, where the environment is much more comfortable and I can use equipment the school doesn't have, where I can wait until I'm in the right mood to focus, where nobody is pestering me about the intermediary stages of my work, etc.

It also seems like a waste of having an expert around to be doing something you could do at home without them.

Exams should increasingly be written with the idea in mind that students can and will use AI. Open book exams are great. They're just harder to write.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#287

Post by wombatpm »

djhn wrote: post #196
ryandrake wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reply brings to mind the well-known Heinlein quote: A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallan…

It’s a quote from a character in Heinlein’s fiction. A human character with a lifespan of over a thousand years. I too liked that quote and found it inspiring. Until I read the book, that is.

I know the character is Lazarus Long. Which book was this quote in?

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#288

Post by sorokod »

bko wrote: post #35
dtnewman wrote: post #14

> A common question is: “how much are students using AI to cheat?” That’s hard to answer, especially as we don’t know the specific educational context where each of Claude’s responses is being used. I built a popular product that helps teachers with this problem. Yes, it's "hard to answer", but let's be honest... it's a very very widespread problem. I've talked to hundreds of teachers about this and it's a ubiquitous…

When modern search became more available, a lot of people said there's no point of rote memorization as you can just do a Google search. That's more or less accepted today. Whenever we have a new technology there's a response "why do I need to learn X if I can always do Y", and more or less, it has proven true, although not immediately. For instance, I'm not too concerned about my child's ability to write very legibl…

For the same reason you should learn how to walk in a world that has utility scooters.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#289

Post by [deleted] »

hackyhacky wrote: post #70
kibwen wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The irreducible answer to "why should I" is that it makes you ever-more-increasingly reliant on a teetering tower of fragile and interdependent supply chains furnished by for-profit companies who are all too eager to rake you over the coals to fulfill basic cognitive functions. Like, Socrates may have been against writing because he thought it made your memory weak, but at least I, an individual, am perfectly capable…

> The irreducible answer to "why should I" is that it makes you ever-more-increasingly reliant on a teetering tower of fragile and interdependent supply chains furnished by for-profit companies who are all too eager to rake you over the coals to fulfill basic cognitive functions. Yes, but that horse has long ago left the barn. I don't know how to grow crops, build a house, tend livestock, make clothes, weld metal, bu…

[deleted]

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#290

Post by dullcrisp »

Vvector wrote: post #55
noitpmeder wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an insane take. The issue is that, when presented with a situation that requires writing legibly, spelling well, or reading a map, WITHOUT their AI assistants, they will fall apart. The AI becomes their brain, such that they cannot function without it. I'd never want to work with someone who is this reliant on technology.

Do you have the skills and knowledge to survive like a pioneer from 200 years ago? Technology is rapidly changing humanity. Maybe for the worse.

Did the pioneers 200 years ago have the skills and knowledge to survive as a serf 400 years ago? Or as a mid-level financial analyst today?

Or is pioneering 200 years ago an in-demand skillset that we should be picking up?

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