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Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

nytimes.com

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Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#281

Post by UncleEntity »

TimPC wrote: post #159
UncleEntity wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Calling the US health care system free market is quite the big stretch. I can honestly not come up with another industry that is subject to higher regulatory burdens. Maybe nuclear power?

Ah yes, the old libertarian cop-out. The most free market healthcare system in the world is too highly regulated and if we just take the regulations away it will perform better because ideology. This is despite the fact that if you look at healthcare systems in the world most performance metrics improve with more regulation but not less. But lets forget about being data-driven when ideological purity is at stake.

I don't have any real issue with regulations per se but with people claiming that a highly regulated market is 'free market'.

I'm actually quite happy with my socialized health care aside from the last time I went to the emergency room they sent me home to die and when I came back a day later they were rapidly pulling out faulty body parts before I did indeed die. Well, then there's the Phoenix VA death list scandal.

I know I shouldn't complain as it not like I risked life and limb in service of my country and earned it as a direct result of military service or anything.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#282

Post by locallost »

6bb32646d83d wrote: post #137

Unfortunately it means it's extremely hard to live in Paris if you're middle class. If you're upper middle class/rich, you can rent/buy. If you're poor, you get a chance to get public housing. If you're middle class, too bad for you.

Is it that much different from anywhere else in that regard? The fact the poorer people get something, doesn't mean they lose something. I'd guess on average despite higher cost of living, they wouldn't trade places.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#283

Post by scott_w »

SV_BubbleTime wrote: post #251
fnord123 wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's false. People will not go into suspend mode when not walking; they still burn calories. A very large person would burn about 130 calories walking a mile. i.e. one large latte. And most people who are this large are not at risk of a caloric deficit by burning an extra 130 calories.

A single mile, no. 100 miles? That seems very likely. That happens far quicker for the energy leaking heat machine sitting in the seat. So, while maybe the theme of the statement is correct?

It's simply not.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#284

Post by Aunche »

slibhb wrote: post #197
smeej wrote: post #169

> The program has allowed Mr. Chaillou and his wife to raise their two boys in the city. But he knows that the future of social housing will always face at least one big challenge: “The problem is that once you get in, you never want to leave.” I think this is the reason so many in the U.S. are skeptical of/resistant to such plans. Why work your butt off for 10 years to get to a place where you can afford a nice dwel…

> American culture doesn't like to think about how much of "success" is down to luck. As often as possible, we want to think it's earned. The idea of trying to make up for some of the luck factor by taking some from those with more and giving it to those with less is almost instinctively repugnant, even if it might lead to higher quality of life for everyone involved. The US is in the ballpark of other OECD countries…

The US government actually spends more per capita on healthcare than the UK or Japan despite it not being universal. We're terribly inefficient with its social spending because have politics is so adversarial and nobody is interested in doing any due diligence.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#285

Post by digging »

bboygravity wrote: post #52
bedobi wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to think like you but no longer do. A city NEEDS to have people of all ages, backgrounds, income levels etc in it to not die. Yes those people who live in that most central subsidized housing are in some ways winning a lottery ticket, and the real policy is to build a lot more housing as close to the city as possible. But Paris are doing that! AND adding new public transit etc etc. This multifaceted approach i…

Why does everybody need to concentrate in huge cities? If Romans where able to relatively evenly spread their towns and population all over the place in the analogue age, then why aren't we able to do so in the digital age?

The principles would be the same even if we concentrated on small cities. A city must promote social diversity to grow the quality of social interaction (even indirect interactions, like walking through a neighborhood built by different ideas and in different styles).

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#286

Post by kspacewalk2 »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #162
kspacewalk2 wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not at all obvious. What is obvious is that returns on many investments, such as vastly improving housing and transportation for city residents, have multi-year lags. Like, obviously when you just spent billions on improving your RER, properly redesigning your streets to not be deadly by design anymore, and buying up housing, you'll be in the read that fiscal year. >"taxe fonciere" [property tax] doubled last year My…

Well, you can insist on looking at things through rose-tinted glasses or notpicking. But the facts I highlighted are inescapable... And I won't even get into how ghastly areas around the Eiffel Tower (for instance) have become with crime, beggars, etc everywhere.

You highlighted no facts, actually. The one fact was off by a factor of 2 and missing all context. What you call "nitpicking" is in fact the process of forming an opinion using facts and context. You could offer valuable insights, presumably being a Parisian, but instead you switch topics to beggars and crime. Oh well.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#287

Post by Jensson »

ReptileMan wrote: post #190
rcpt wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People aren't very noisy. Cars are

I have never met a car that had a fight with her spouse that woke up the whole block at 3AM

You need better walls, aren't there standards that apartment walls need to be sound proof?

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#288

Post by digging »

bko wrote: post #51
bedobi wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to think like you but no longer do. A city NEEDS to have people of all ages, backgrounds, income levels etc in it to not die. Yes those people who live in that most central subsidized housing are in some ways winning a lottery ticket, and the real policy is to build a lot more housing as close to the city as possible. But Paris are doing that! AND adding new public transit etc etc. This multifaceted approach i…

Ok,think of the politician you dislike the most. Now imagine the discretion of "people of all ages backgrounds income levels etc" would fall to his or her purview to decide. Would you still support the system? We should have a clear objective system of governance that allows even terrible people to oversee it

> Now imagine the discretion of "people of all ages backgrounds income levels etc" would fall to his or her purview to decide.

How much room for discretion is there actually in promoting diversity? I suppose you could forcibly break up poorer immigrant communities which would be pretty harmful.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#289

Post by dugmartin »

cultureswitch wrote: post #112
bko wrote: post #4

The problem with charging below market prices for anything is that it necessarily leads to a mismatch of supply and demand. So the question is how do you allocate that supply? One way is to have hidden costs. This could range from straight up bribes, to paid consultants to fill out a lot of forms or talk to the right people, to just knowing someone Another way is a lottery which benefits a tiny percentage of people.…

When someone rents a small apartment in the center of Paris for 4k on the private market in all likeliness they're paying more than 3k of pure rent profit to the owner. The rent can be levied by the owner however the owner actually did not provide any of the investment or labor required to give the apartment the value it has. The apartment has value not because of anything inside the apartment or the building. It has…

You've left out a few things the landlord does and the risks they assume (at least here in the USA, I'm not sure about Paris):

   - mortgage costs
   - property taxes
   - insurance
   - utilities
   - repairs
   - maintenance
   - savings for large future capital outlays (new roof, furnace, etc)
   - renters not paying
   - empty rental units
   - loss of investment opportunities of the capital locked up in the building
   - possible loss of all income due to fire, etc
   - 34 other things I'll leave out
It may look like landlords have it easy but as a former commercial landlord I can tell you it is not easy at all.

Re: Paris preserves its mixed society by pouring billions into public housing

#290

Post by intalentive »

foldr wrote: post #139
seper8 wrote: post #19

[flagged]

Some people just don't like cities. Google pretty much any major Western city and you can find comments complaining that it's dirty, riddled with crime and has too many immigrants. Paris is a real place, not a theme park.

Western cities weren't always like this. They don't have to be like this.
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