Earlier quoted context omitted.
Assuming you’re talking about money, how does one pay for a pardon?
He didn’t pay. But Peter Thiel and Palmer Luckey (two big Republican donors) recommended him to the Trump team for a pardon, and Trump obliged.
Ex-Google engineer charged with stealing trade secrets
281–290 of 497 posts
Re: Ex-Google engineer charged with stealing trade secrets
#282Earlier quoted context omitted.
Japan did the same thing before and after the world wars. This is not really that new or strange. India has been doing the same thing. Russia as well. it's standard practice to send people to more advanced countries to train and then have them come back and start companies based on what they have learned. this is why Patents only really work in local regions or within a Nation. the biggest difference is that China ha…
Blatant is another way of saying successful. Not many countries have system in place to incentivize reverse brain drain, and even in PRC that was hard fought. It's difficult to compete with US tech wages propped up by cheap money. Big reason why PRC can get talent to come back, and with IP is because they pay accordingly and, most importantly, have system in place where that knowledge can be exploited. Another big re…
Most regional powers do.
The Chinese program is based on Japan's METI, Taiwan's MEA, and Israel's MoE.
These 3 countries devised the primary reverse brain drain programs that countries like China, South Korea, Turkey, India, etc began emulating in the 2000s-2010s.
Re: Ex-Google engineer charged with stealing trade secrets
#283Earlier quoted context omitted.
> We should be figuring out how to create a global, collective, human advantage for everyone and the planet We haven’t solved the problem of governance. The End of History seemed close in the 1990s. But we’re back to being torn between the efficiency (and short-term stability) of authoritarian models against the flexibility (and long-term stability) of democratic ones. Until we find the model that just works, this co…
You need a model that is not financed through extortion. By granting a small part of the population rights and duties that would be criminal for anyone else to perform (do you even have a right to extort, kidnap, and murder?), you are playing people against each other and perpetuating a struggle for control of the government to act on their behalf, at the expense of everyone else. governance ≠ government As long as e…
Re: Ex-Google engineer charged with stealing trade secrets
#284Earlier quoted context omitted.
You need a model that is not financed through extortion. By granting a small part of the population rights and duties that would be criminal for anyone else to perform (do you even have a right to extort, kidnap, and murder?), you are playing people against each other and perpetuating a struggle for control of the government to act on their behalf, at the expense of everyone else. governance ≠ government As long as e…
> granting a small part of the population rights and duties that would be criminal for anyone else to perform No, I don’t want anyone to have nuclear codes. And yes, I want someone to ensure randos aren’t building nukes. > governance ≠ government Sure, but to the degree we’ve made progress on the problem of governance, it’s been in proving the necessity of government. Anarchist collectives far well until someone come…
I think there's a pretty strong argument that global military is close to a zero-sum game, but I agree that this doesn't mean there is a obvious alternative.
Last, I think it's pretty indisputable that there's been significant scope creep given that western government taxation & spending are now pushing 50% of GDP. If you look at the US, the federal government was 2% of GDP in 1920, and closer to 25% today. This is despite 10x in inflation adjusted GDP per capita. This means that more realistically, government is consuming/directing 100x more productive capacity per person.
Re: Ex-Google engineer charged with stealing trade secrets
#285Earlier quoted context omitted.
You need a model that is not financed through extortion. By granting a small part of the population rights and duties that would be criminal for anyone else to perform (do you even have a right to extort, kidnap, and murder?), you are playing people against each other and perpetuating a struggle for control of the government to act on their behalf, at the expense of everyone else. governance ≠ government As long as e…
Do you have a practical solution that you think people would adopt?
Re: Ex-Google engineer charged with stealing trade secrets
#286Earlier quoted context omitted.
Now the biggest issue is to get those that train to come back. A lot of Russians chose not to, same with Indians, and Japanese. China has an extensive espionage network focused on keeping track of exchange students and make sure that they fall in line. Much more so than any other nation. have a friend from Malaysia and they had this smart idea that if you study abroad and get a PhD or Masters (as I understood it) you…
> chose not to, same with Indians Not anymore. It's because of visa and naturalization backlogs. When I was a kid growing up in the 90s and 2000s, it was common for Chinese nationals to naturalize and become citizens. When the Chinese backlog reached a decade long 10-20 years ago, a lot of top tier Chinese talent decided to return to China because employment visa hell sucks and the Chinese private sector formalized a…
Re: Ex-Google engineer charged with stealing trade secrets
#287What exactly sterling secrets looks like? Suppose I work on a video streaming service. Spent 8 years. Now I know in and out of it. The ffmpeg the queues the buckets the meta data and what not. Someone hires me. I build a steaming service. But this time I'm much more polished and faster. Is this stealing too?
Re: Ex-Google engineer charged with stealing trade secrets
#288Earlier quoted context omitted.
> chose not to, same with Indians Not anymore. It's because of visa and naturalization backlogs. When I was a kid growing up in the 90s and 2000s, it was common for Chinese nationals to naturalize and become citizens. When the Chinese backlog reached a decade long 10-20 years ago, a lot of top tier Chinese talent decided to return to China because employment visa hell sucks and the Chinese private sector formalized a…
I was not aware of that, thanks for sharing! It does explain why I have seen more indian recruitment in EU from India and China since our backlog or naturalization process is only 5 years of living in the country and then 1-3 years for the bureaucracy to manage the application.
Top tier employers in both countries can pay Warsaw or Prague level salaries (eg. An IIT Kanpur class of 2024 undergraduate's average starting base salary is US$30,000 in India alone [0]), and you aren't going to be a de facto indentured servant
Generally, Indian+Chinese talent that emigrates to the EU tend to be those whose career growth is limited due to attending non-target schools or lower tier companies.
This excludes graduate students at top tier European institutions (eg. TU Munich, EPFL, etc) who are there explicitly for research, but end up returning to their home countries due to competitive tenure or funding offers.
20 years ago, a Chinese or Indian national attending TU Munich for a PhD would probably stay in Europe, but nowadays they get competitive tenure track offers at IITs or Double First Class Universities.
[0] - https://m.economictimes.com/jobs/fresher/iit-kanpur-class-of...
Re: Ex-Google engineer charged with stealing trade secrets
#289Earlier quoted context omitted.
What Liberal principle requires you to employ and inform your enemies who are actively engaging in espionage? I didn't say anything about Chinese /ethnicity/, only nationality. There are millions of ethnically Chinese people around the world who are not Chinese nationals and are not bound by the same legal framework.
> employ and inform your enemies This is literally presumption of guilt based on where someone was born. It's the literal definition of prejudice . Very illiberal. Mind you, I am not claiming that you have to be liberal. I just want honesty and consistency. If we all oppose China because they threaten liberty, then we must protect liberty. But if you oppose China just because it's a pissing contest between superpower…
Not where someone is born, but whom they owe allegiance to. If you do not discriminate based on someone's allegiances, then on what basis would you expect it to be appropriate to discriminate? The idea that all discrimination is immoral or unethical is not only suspect, it's clearly foolhardy. China is an enemy to everyone who is not China, they aren't even subtle about this. China only cares about China, and will sabotage or interrupt deals and commit espionage in order to get ahead. Anyone who owes allegiance to China is not a friend of the West, full stop. The West and the entities operating in it owe no benefit of the doubt or benefit at all towards anyone who has allegiance to China. China holds no such ridiculous notion as that they shouldn't discriminate based on allegiance, they make it clear you are either theirs or you are unwelcome.
Note, I am also /not/ saying that China is necessarily doing anything immoral within their own framework here, I am simply observing that they are not, and have not been, any friend to the West, and they are clearly at this point our enemy. Just because they are our enemy does not mean that their behaviors aren't rational from their perspective or point of view and don't align with their own moral systems. We don't owe them any regard or benefit of the doubt however, as they are our enemy, and it's just as much not immoral for us to uphold ourselves against our enemies.
> It's the literal definition of prejudice. Very illiberal.
You and I have different definitions of prejudice and what it means to be Liberal. My definition of prejudice matches what's in the dictionary:
noun
1. The act or state of holding unreasonable preconceived judgments or convictions.
2. An adverse judgment or opinion formed unfairly or without knowledge of the facts.
3. Irrational suspicion or hatred of a particular social group, such as a race or the adherents of a religion.
Acting to protect yourself from an enemy and its nationals is not unreasonable, based on any unfairness, based on lack of knowledge of the facts, nor is it irrational, therefore the preconditions of prejudice aren't present. When you have a clear, rational, open basis for discrimination, it's not prejudicial, it's simply prudent.Re: Ex-Google engineer charged with stealing trade secrets
#290Earlier quoted context omitted.
> but a bunch of populist anti-China measures have prevented Chinese STEM talent from naturalizing, so we aren't getting the cream of the crop anymore I thought it was just the green card quotas, since once you get a GC naturalizing only takes a few years. The quotas are dumb, but are not specifically anti-china.
Not GC quotas - the backlog is 2 years now for Chinese nationals It's EO 10043 [0] that's the blocker. If you are a Chinese national who is in some way affiliated with tbe Chinese Civil-Military fusion, you cannot get a visa to the US. This EO is horribly written, as it essentially treats all Chinese universities or programs that get some kind of military funding (even a relatively minor grant) as part of the Civil-M…
The crazy thing is that these are generally lower tier universities in China. What a strange law. I can imagine this making those universities much less popular in future admittances.