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Stories removed from the Hacker News Front Page, updated in real time

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Re: Stories removed from the Hacker News Front Page, updated in real time

#281
post #66

I went to check if the story I submitted today ( Breathing 101 — https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39227295 ) was present in the list, and it was indeed! I don't know how it reached the front page and why it got removed.

I would have downvoted that for a number of reasons. I guess people flagged it, since there's no downvote. I don't flag unless it's something egregious (racism, spam, etc). But since this thread is all about the topic of why stories might not make the cut here, this is why I would have downvoted it if I could:

1. "Breathing 101" is an uninformative headline. I correctly guessed that it was literally referring to the human act of breathing, but it's still a bad title (I know it's not your title, and that HN encourages using the original source's title; it just sucks).

2. You submitted the link with no comment or context about what the article was or why it might be interesting. If a headline grabs my eye, I always click on the "N comments" link and the article link to open two tabs, and I look for additional descriptive text from the submitter, or a comment from them about what they found interesting. Sometimes I read the actual article first, but if the title is ambiguous or the topic is contentious, I'll usually start with the comments tab and see if I'm going to be wasting my time before I read an article. This alone wouldn't be a reason to downvote, but if I was leaning that way, it would factor in.

3. The word "wellness" in the link's domain is a huge red flag. To me it means "this is going to be a bunch of hippie crap". Not a primary factor, but seeing that would be enough to make me dig farther and find evidence so that I could Angry Downvote something I don't want to see on HN ever, if we could downvote. Yes, this is petty.

4. The very top of the linked article says "Click here to make an appointment". This indicates spam.

5. The article is just bad. There's not much information. It's not scientific. It touches lightly on some potentially interesting things but doesn't dive into them at all, or link to better sources, and it ends with what appears to be advice and encouragement to incorporate breathing exercises, but without much information about how or what the benefit is.

It looks like spam. It's the kind of clickbait that floods my Facebook feed.

Re: Stories removed from the Hacker News Front Page, updated in real time

#282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "force" is actually one or two people. It's hard to prove and impossible to change. No one will believe you, either.

If it works.. There are a billion forums with less stringent moderation. Moderation is a very large part that makes HN good and not so game-able like most sites

[deleted]

Re: Stories removed from the Hacker News Front Page, updated in real time

#283
post #3

Looking at the list of removed stories makes me really happy with the moderators here. They're all sensationalist, advertising for some company, clickbait, way off topic, or some combination of above. In fact, I don't see a single story that I personally feel should not have been removed. Thanks, mods.

> mod*s*

plural ?

Re: Stories removed from the Hacker News Front Page, updated in real time

#284
post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wtf are you talking about? He’s literally telling us and has mentioned in the community many times that flagging quickly crushes a story. I’ve seen it happen when I’ve flagged stories so either there is a vast conspiracy of moderators that receive pages when I flag things so they can downrank… or maybe dang isn’t lying about something that should be super obvious as a community self policing mechanism.

> Wtf are you talking about? He’s literally telling us and has mentioned in the community many times that flagging quickly crushes a story. It's discussed in the link, and elsewhere [1]. Some mod actions on HN are transparent, some are not. You should not assume that, just because you see marks of some form of moderation, that you can see them all. Undisclosed content moderation is like directly modifying your produc…

If you want a site with a public mod log, there's Lobsters. If you want a site with a mod log that's cryptographically auditable by users, I'm sure blockchainia has something on offer. You're not going to get either of those things here, for reasons the community has dug into in the past and you can surface with the search bar.

Re: Stories removed from the Hacker News Front Page, updated in real time

#285
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The first two you listed were downranked by the flamewar detector. The last one was downranked by users. Admins didn't touch any of them. Note for everybody: can you guys please include the HN /item link if you're mentioning specific threads? That would be much more efficient and that way I can answer many more of people's questions.

Why don’t you make the system transparent? This will save you a lot of effort answering questions.

[flagged]

Re: Stories removed from the Hacker News Front Page, updated in real time

#286
post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wtf are you talking about? He’s literally telling us and has mentioned in the community many times that flagging quickly crushes a story. It's discussed in the link, and elsewhere [1]. Some mod actions on HN are transparent, some are not. You should not assume that, just because you see marks of some form of moderation, that you can see them all. Undisclosed content moderation is like directly modifying your produc…

If you want a site with a public mod log, there's Lobsters. If you want a site with a mod log that's cryptographically auditable by users, I'm sure blockchainia has something on offer. You're not going to get either of those things here, for reasons the community has dug into in the past and you can surface with the search bar.

I support transparent-to-the-author content moderation, and I suspect that is in the future for today's major platforms, whether they want it or not.

Re: Stories removed from the Hacker News Front Page, updated in real time

#287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But why must they be dreadful? Genuine question, I am not being obtuse. We should be able as a community to discuss conterversial subjects somehow. I also think this sort of thing invites flag brigades. Or better yet, a small batch of bad actor can easily start brigading and forcefully associate such flamewar expectations with any subject they don't like to drive it off HN. Maybe worth reconsidering how you flag? You…

I don't know why they're dreadful, but they empirically are, and that's the end of the matter for me.

Empirically they are not. What you mean is that you don't like to be faced with the reality revealed by these stories and the comments.

But this attitude explains a lot of the abusive flagging that goes on here. Stories get flagged because they make people feel ick, and they feel ick because they previously took positions that were wrong. So they flag. And when asked, why do you flag, they say "I don't know, I just don't like it", forgetting that the site exists supposedly to help drive intellectual curiousity. You may not like these stories, but other people do find them useful and you should not interfere with them.

Re: Stories removed from the Hacker News Front Page, updated in real time

#288
post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> lots of people flag stories based on their experience of what the threads are like IMHO story submissions should be judged based upon their own merits. Toxic commenters can be downvoted/banned but the story submitter shouldn't be punished for the misbehavior of others. > I didn't flag (or see) that story, but I would have. You mean purely based on the expected awfulness of imagined future comments, instead of the a…

It's good to want things! We can just disagree. There's not enough space on the front page for all the good things we want to read. I'm not interested in expending extra effort to rescue marginal stories with a low likelihood of generating a good conversation. The people most invested in these kinds of stories seem to be almost the least invested in HN's rubric of curious conversation. I don't call any of the shots a…

It doesn't get less curious that "I try to bury discussion before it even happens and can't even explain why". You should be ashamed that you spend so much time here yet fundamentally do not get the rules.

Re: Stories removed from the Hacker News Front Page, updated in real time

#290
post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want a site with a public mod log, there's Lobsters. If you want a site with a mod log that's cryptographically auditable by users, I'm sure blockchainia has something on offer. You're not going to get either of those things here, for reasons the community has dug into in the past and you can surface with the search bar.

I support transparent-to-the-author content moderation, and I suspect that is in the future for today's major platforms, whether they want it or not.

Sure, that could happen. And if it does, it will happen by way of people leaving sites like this one for sites moderated differently. I think we're all OK with letting the market decide.
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