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India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

nature.com

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Re: India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

#281

Post by rustedspoon »

AmIDev wrote: post #267
ephemeralkey wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a silent secular majority in the country that wants absolutely nothing to do with this drivel (i.e., the slide referred to in the parent and what some politicians say as referred to in the GP post). We have always had crackpots (sometimes crackpots in positions of power/influence) who spout nonsense on all flavors of political ideology. Unfortunately, media (traditional and social media) amplifies the nonsen…

As a secular Indian, I highly doubt that majority, or even plurality of Indians are secular. If anything, I've seen most of my friends go from being secular to conservative moderates/hardliners in last few years. I know quite a few people who would support Muslim genocides, including my family.

Agree with you, majority are going from secular to conservative. May be the secular party should ask why.

But also want to add that Indian version conservatives aren’t really comparable to the western one. Just take this issue on evolution itself Hindus and Buddhists are among the most who believe in evolution.

https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2019/02/06/the-evolutio...

Re: India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

#282

Post by 29athrowaway »

User23 wrote: post #277
User23 wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can simulate a creationist environment in which anything in your simulated evolutionary environment also exists. Is that evidence for creationism? No of course not. Computer simulations aren’t evidence for anything. So no.

Come to think of it, according to the simulationists, the existence of computer simulations in our reality is evidence that we live inside such a simulation. So if anything your simulation of evolution is evidence for the simulationist form of intelligent design creationism.

Well, partner, if simulations don't resonate with you go believe whatever you want. Be free and go enjoy the world. Go outdoors, dig a little bit until you find a fossil and then dig a few more of them.

Then, classify those fossils and keep track of where in the geological record you found them. Then try to come up with a plausible explanation of how those fossils ended up there, keeping in consideration their classification and age.

Maybe you will find a consistent trend and then hear about people that have been doing exactly that for many years now. They all seem to have reached a consensus around how those fossils ended up there. It's about a little word that begins with E. You'll find that story very interesting.

Re: India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

#283

Post by onetimeusename »

witchesindublin wrote: post #218
onetimeusename wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen this too. My ex is kind of a Hindu nationalist and her friend group and family are full of them. Her brother even threatened her for dating me saying he would cut off all contact and never let her see his children unless she consented to do an arranged marriage with an Indian (which she secretly came here to escape). But then the same Hindu nationalists had this weird tendency to think they were entitled to…

A lot of the US tech industry was built on the backs of Indians. You'll find that the Indians were the second largest race involved in early computing after the Whites. The second point is that a lot of the problems in India do stem from colonialism - in Asian culture the vast majority don't usually segregate Europe from the US, and view Americans as being just as responsible for colonialism and the benefits of colon…

Was the US tech industry built on the backs of whites also then? You're not denigrating anyone's accomplishment are you?

Re: India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

#284

Post by rinka_singh »

screye wrote: post #23

This makes no sense to me. This highly unlikely to be a political move. Science education is not political in India. Evolution, abortion, chemistry are not debated at all. This is more likely for the reasons to be innocuous. > In explaining its changes, NCERT states on its website that it considered whether content overlapped with similar content covered elsewhere, the difficulty of the content, and whether the conte…

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/class-10-syllabus-change-now... and of course https://twitter.com/ncert/status/1664321985709744128

Fake news. These topics are covered in the relevant (Science) stream in class 12 now. This is simply rationalization of the subjects to reduce burden on the students.

On a related note, I see quite a bit of fake news posted here...

Re: India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

#285

Post by User23 »

29athrowaway wrote: post #282
User23 wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Come to think of it, according to the simulationists, the existence of computer simulations in our reality is evidence that we live inside such a simulation. So if anything your simulation of evolution is evidence for the simulationist form of intelligent design creationism.

Well, partner, if simulations don't resonate with you go believe whatever you want. Be free and go enjoy the world. Go outdoors, dig a little bit until you find a fossil and then dig a few more of them. Then, classify those fossils and keep track of where in the geological record you found them. Then try to come up with a plausible explanation of how those fossils ended up there, keeping in consideration their classi…

The Theory of Evolution by Natural Selection is not uniquely determined by the fossil record. The fossil record is at least as consistent with other macroevolutionary theories and with non-macroevolutionary theories too. Look at it this way, the existence of gravitational experimental data doesn’t determine Newtonian gravity to be correct. And biology is a considerably more tricky subject than mechanics.

I think we can all agree that physics is farther along than biology. But I bet you’d have no problem telling me at least one major open problem with General Relativity. Can you bring yourself to tell me even one major open problem with the Theory of Evolution by Natural Selection? If not is that a psychological deficiency on your part, or is that theory somehow uniquely flawless?

As for consensus, it’s as irrelevant to reality as computer simulations. Historically speaking the vast majority of human consensuses on anything, including science, have been wrong almost all of the time. The overwhelming arrogance to believe that we’re now fundamentally different is stultifying.

Re: India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

#286

Post by [deleted] »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #164
hayst4ck wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a question of where your core axioms come from. The core axiom from which a person builds a belief system can be that contradictions are wrong or that authority (the bible/priest/parent) is right. This is why conservatives frequently fail to respond to pointing out their contradictions. Their core axiom is one of authority, contradictions have little bearing on their analysis of what is true or not. New informat…

This isn't a useful analysis because you are describing general human challenges beyond political bents. Also India has a completely different alignment compared to US-Left/Right and they still struggle from similar issues.

[deleted]

Re: India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

#287

Post by nickcotter »

kamaal wrote: post #244
godelski wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also like bragging that you were a highly advanced civilization and got conquered/occupied by a bunch of dumb savages. There's a few more prominent countries that follow similar narratives and I agree with you that it sounds far more embarrassing than boasting. And if you're superior then why haven't you caught up or surpassed the others? I can understand if this is like As to why it works, I completely understa…

>>It's also like bragging that you were a highly advanced civilization and got conquered/occupied by a bunch of dumb savages. They explain that part by using the idea of 'traitors'. They are often the minorities of that land(whom they currently hate, and serve as a nice punching bag in the whole process, and in the overall scheme of hate process). The 'traitor' part is like a constant theme in these stories. Super ad…

It’s a popular gambit in various guises:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stab-in-the-back_myth

Re: India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

#288

Post by [deleted] »

blagie wrote: post #257
29athrowaway wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Evolution can be simulated in a computer as a reproducible experiment and I have even done it myself. Genetic algorithms, evolutionary computing, etc. So no.

I will push back here. The fossil record shows change over time. There are several theories consistent with the facts: (1) Evolution by natural selection (2) Evolution guided by God (3) God created the world 5000 years ago, but didn't want to leave evidence to leave open the question of faith There are many others. You will find some more reasonable than others, and for others, it's the reverse. A big part of what I'…

[deleted]

Re: India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

#289

Post by lannisterstark »

kamaal wrote: post #247
witchesindublin wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tamils also have a similar concept.

Tamils mostly take pride in the age of their language and its continued use till date. They also make their identity around this. They don't claim that every language originated from theirs or that computers need to be programmed with Tamil.

A lot of them absolutely do. there are plenty of memes about You lot doing the same thing. Just search for "Tamil language original meme"

Re: India cuts periodic table and evolution from school textbooks

#290

Post by rideofvalkyrie »

Don't let facts stand in your way to senseless propaganda. The textbooks are all available online.

Periodic table: https://ncert.nic.in/textbook.php?kech1=3-6

Evolution: https://ncert.nic.in/textbook.php?lebo1=6-13

http://www.indiatodayne.in/national/story/ncert-syllabus-row...

TLDR: Nature and most other western publications failed to do basic fact check, neither periodic table or evolution are 'cut' from textbooks. They're just moved to a different grade.

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