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It seems that the good times for online Minecraft play are over

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Re: It seems that the good times for online Minecraft play are over

#281

Post by fxtentacle »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #202
jaarse wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the issue is the ease of getting users banned, and the lack of actual moderating at all that is the problem. It literally is as easy as fill out the form, user is automatically banned, no verification required. Microsoft is not actually enforcing anything. My son is 10 and has been playing Minecraft for most of his life. I would consider him quite good at it. I sometimes watch. Every couple of months one of h…

> Every couple of months one of his friends will get banned for no reason. I know you want to trust your child’s friends, but “it happened for no reason” is exactly what kids say when they don’t want to own up to the consequences of their actions. Obviously, you can only monitor your own child’s gameplay and not what their friends are doing on their own time. I strongly suspect there’s more going on than you realize.…

I have a group of 30+ friends who play minecraft, use a separate TeamSpeak server and they also regularly talk about getting banned without obvious reason.

And I was once banned from Dota2 for "intentional feeding" which I guess is just a fancy way of saying that the others in my team expected my skill level to be higher than it was.

These online ban systems really are random. And typically the "moderation" is fully automated. I predict soon GPT3 will write the message to inform you.

Re: It seems that the good times for online Minecraft play are over

#282

Post by watwut »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #190
lolinder wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the event of abuse, parents won't draw that distinction and neither would a Twitter mob. Microsoft needs to be able to point to something concrete they're doing to keep kids safe or they're risking a scandal.

For servers that kids are supposed to be on, sure. Not all servers.

Doxxing and raids on individuals, targeted sexual harassments, there are all kinds of online actions we keep away from adult oriented internet services too.

Re: It seems that the good times for online Minecraft play are over

#283

Post by tiahura »

EMIRELADERO wrote: post #148
caslon wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Minecraft is transparently not a good. You get a license to it, you don't own it. You don't buy the copy, you buy the license to the copy. You go to the video store, you get a VHS tape. You don't own the media on the tape. You can use the tape. That is the deal for proprietary software. That's what you agreed to with your purchase. You consented to the model. You agreed to the terms of the license. There's nothing mi…

You should check out Andino v. Apple , an ongoing lawsuit in which the plaintiff alledges that the use of the "Buy" button is fraudulent if content is truly not bought. I feel like you are confusing copyright law with contract law. I can purchase Minecraft without agreeing to any EULA. It only appears after you download the launcher. Here are the two types of unconscionability: The basic test applied for unconscionab…

* It is not the EULA that allows me to use the software.*

ProCD said it was way back in ‘96. It’s still good law isn’t it?

As to unconscionability, the subject matter is relevant. In other words, there aren’t any video game cases in the unconscionability section of the typical contracts textbook.

Re: It seems that the good times for online Minecraft play are over

#284

Post by drusepth »

djbusby wrote: post #144
donatj wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It removes any and all reason to play online. Might as well play bots.

Rocket League has an option called quick-chat. It's only canned messages. And in QC mode you only see or reply QC messages. Make being real toxic difficult.

Dota 2 uses a very similar system (in parallel with several other ways to communicate). It works really well: "chat wheel" communication is significantly more efficient than typing, or even talking, and always on-topic. There are a lot of games where I'll immediately ignore/mute all players' text- and voice-capabilities and solely leave canned chat wheel pings for communication.

Re: It seems that the good times for online Minecraft play are over

#285

Post by vintermann »

caslon wrote: post #105
StanislavPetrov wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many people bought the game before these draconian policies were implemented? They should offer refunds.

That's not the deal with proprietary software. The deal is that you buy a license to software, the terms of which can be altered at any time. It's fundamental to the model of proprietary software. It's not theirs. It's the company's, and the company can do what they want with it. There's no reason refunds should be offered, as the consumers got what they paid for: A license to software, with certain conditions for te…

> That's not the deal with proprietary software. The deal is that you buy a license to software, the terms of which can be altered at any time.

You're acting as if Microsoft developed this game. They didn't. I bet most people posting here bought it at the time the license "made lawyers very nervous" according to Notch himself (even after he said that, he only changed the license very slightly).

Re: It seems that the good times for online Minecraft play are over

#287

Post by watwut »

lolinder wrote: post #22
8jy89hui wrote: post #2

Does anyone have any insight into why Microsoft thought this was necessary? Minecraft has been server-moderated for years now and has been wildly successful. I've never heard of any hate groups or even hateful servers (I'm sure they exist, but they don't make the news in a way that would harm Microsoft). Is there some legislation that would make it a liability for Microsoft to not moderate all the chat? This move jus…

Roblox has been mired in controversy for years for failing to keep their platform safe enough for the kids they target. I'm not familiar enough to comment on the details of that controversy, but I would be surprised if that didn't feature prominently in Microsoft's decision here.

That controversy is kept only inside certain circles. I think that "mired in controversy" is too strong expression for what is going on there. And also, roblox is actually banning people right and left too.

Re: It seems that the good times for online Minecraft play are over

#288

Post by bspammer »

BeefWellington wrote: post #210
ShowalkKama wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

opt-in "self flagging". Logic is a parent can report the date of birth of the child at time of purchase (maybe set up an email to receive a confirmation in case you want to disable the kid mode).

Ah, but then you have adults "self flagging" as children to be awful.

So? All the kid servers in this hypothetical would be heavily moderated.

Re: It seems that the good times for online Minecraft play are over

#289

Post by fxtentacle »

RUN12 wrote: post #229
causalmodels wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you name a single moderation system that operates on this scale that will not automatically ban someone for getting mass reported? This is a fairly well known phenomenon.

That's obviously not what's happening here though. I have plenty of adult friends who go on public and private servers and actively trash talk during games and have never been banned. And none of their friends have been banned. A small group of 10 year-old children aren't having a coordinated attack of hundreds to thousands of reports against them repeatedly over many months. Not to mention tacking on the requirement…

having your internet connection disconnect is also a ban-able offense ...

Re: It seems that the good times for online Minecraft play are over

#290

Post by xdrosenheim »

ckemere wrote: post #94

It's apparently a minority voice opinion here on HN, but I for one appreciate what Microsoft is trying to do. As a parent of a 6 and 9 year old who have really gotten into Minecraft during COVID, I appreciate them basically deciding "We want Minecraft to be a game for kids and an online community that is nice." I get why people are frustrated, but I also like the idea of a global decision that forces servers open to…

You should not let you children play with random 30 year olds, if you do not want them to see/hear profanity.

You have the option to install your own chat moderation tools, client-sided, there is not need to force every to "be nice" just because there _might_ be children playing.

If this was just for their own Realm Servers, that would be fine, it is their server, they host it. But why does Microsoft suddenly feel the need to moderate MY server? (public, but only used by friends of mine)

All the big public servers, such as Hypixel, have had their own moderators and they do a fantastic job.

> I don't see anything in their process that suggest that a group of adults playing with their friends are at risk of having their chat audited in the absence of a complaint? The thing is that we have NO IDEA how much it takes to be banned. - Will an actual human look at the reports? Doubtful. - When a ban is to be issued, who will decide when to do that? Some guy who has to follow a script that reads "3 profanities, max" and click the boot button?

The Minecraft community is one of the largest gaming communities, and I have seen very little controversial about it. I do not see the need for Microsoft to suddenly step in and decide to moderate it.

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