On YouTube’s recommendation system • Hacker News Board

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#281

Post by smoldesu » Sat, Sep 18, 2021, 3:15 AM UTC

Renaud wrote: post #265

rubicon33 wrote: post #155

Be careful with YouTube. For years people have talked about social media's effect on mental health, but personally, I've found the biggest hit to be YouTube. Their recommendation system is really the heart of the beast. It's essentially a dopamine reward system, not too dissimilar from a slot machine at a casino. Pull the lever (refresh the page) and get random results! It sucks you in to a cycle of refreshing, findi…

Unhook is a godsend. I'm still spending too much time on YT but at least I am not sucked in by the endless Algorithm of never ending videos. Unhook for Firefox: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-recom...

FreeTube (freetubeapp.io) implements options for that too, I've found it wonderfully effective to keep me focused.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#282

Post by cloverich » Sat, Sep 18, 2021, 3:29 AM UTC

city41 wrote: post #104

lordentropy wrote: post #5

For me, it seems like youtube's recommendation system mostly gets stuck in the local optimum. Once you watch a video from a particular channel, it'll keep on recommending the videos from the same channel for months. Soon, the recommendation just consists of stuff from the channels that have you already viewed. You rarely see new types of recommendations.

I am a huge YouTube addict and get sucked into it a lot. I used to discover all kinds of great channels and really enjoyed it. But lately I have noticed I'm not really finding much and the amount of watching I am doing has gone down a lot. Not sure if they changed the algorithm, or if I've just seen everything I like. I have definitely noticed YouTube is recommending me more clickbaity and mainstream stuff lately.

I wonder if the cat and mouse game of seo is being played out again in “algorithm land” and content creators have learned how to optimize their own content for promotion. I usually blame just the algorithm but maybe i’ve been oversimplifying a larger problem.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#283

Post by LordDragonfang » Sat, Sep 18, 2021, 3:35 AM UTC

andrepd wrote: post #260

swalsh wrote: post #11

The reccomendation system is absolutely dangerous. Just this summer, I watched one video on peppers out of curiousity. By the end of summer I've got multiple different varieties growing, and all the accessories to support them. I'm really enjoying my garden, but it's very unlikely I would have started one without the youtube algorithm. Similarly my doctor reccomended I exercise more, so I started running. Then I goog…

On a more serious side, I searched for a 20s video of a funny gaffe by the President of my country, and immediately my feed was flooded by videos from the local right-populist party's fake news propaganda channel. It's that easy for an unwary person just out to watch a funny video to become exposed to a torrent of bullshit. Anecdotally (n=1, I know), I watch/listen to a lot of leftist lectures and speeches and my fee…

I know for a fact that a sizable portion (if not a majority) of far-right content gets heavily downranked (and in many cases filtered completely from) in the algorithm as "low quality content".

The problem is that the right is much better at producing flashy, low-attention/low-commitment content - the kinds of things that excel in the metrics the algorithm would naively optimize for. Case in point, the lectures you watch are nearly the exact opposite of that popular, easily-digestible content.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#284

Post by fithisux » Sat, Sep 18, 2021, 3:36 AM UTC

The article for me reads that the recommendation system carries the Bias of Youtube. So it is a recommender system that allows control from the owner. This means this recommendation system is not free but it may "train" the consumer on a specific content and act as an echo chamber.

Is earth flat? Of course not but should we punish people for thinking this? Our society says verbally no but its choices say otherwise, they try to do it through undemocratic processes (aka Youtube???). If we provide better education to these people or even a better Health System accessible to everyone we can have better results.

IMHO in the long run Youtube will just send these people to other more "hospitable" platforms and I have a feeling that it will help increase the number of flat earthers. So Youtube is in an interaction with its customers not only to maintain their echo chamber but possibly engineer the echoes. The decrease in variability of members is a way.

Do we need armadillos when we eat chicken?

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#285

Post by rasz » Sat, Sep 18, 2021, 3:41 AM UTC

LeoPanthera wrote: post #54

A lot of comments here seem to not know: 1. If you don't have your YouTube activity history enabled, the algorithm doesn't remember what you've watched and you'll probably get clickbaity/junky recommendations. 2. If you have set your history to expire after some amount of time, it will start re-recommending videos you've already seen once it has forgotten you have watched them. You can set both options here: https://…

This is NOT TRUE on both accounts.

1 Iv had my YT history disabled for >5 years now. Recommendation still works just like for everyone else.

2 Even when enabled it will always keep recommending videos you already watched.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#286

Post by gmathews » Sat, Sep 18, 2021, 4:22 AM UTC

I use YouTube mostly for music. It recommends different versions of the same song I've searched for and am currently listening to. Then because I've watched a video about how to assemble my newly bought IKEA bed, it plays me ads for buying another bed because ...I must be in the market for more beds?

Feels like it's not really trying.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#287

Post by shmde » Sat, Sep 18, 2021, 4:36 AM UTC

If you find yourself indulging in unhealthy amounts of time watching youtube videos on the recommendation page I seriously recommend "Distraction Free for youtube". Its available on chrome and firefox. I remember going to youtube just to watch a video explaining a compsci topic and came out watching a completely random topic. YouTube algorithm is dangerously addictive ( recommendation page ) and the browser extension I mentioned has saved me countless days to cautiously browse YouTube. Hope it helps.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#288

Post by fighterpilot » Sat, Sep 18, 2021, 4:50 AM UTC

kenjackson wrote: post #92

jeffwask wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's sad because I remember being able to find new and interesting creators passively. Now the main page is all corporate BS and the algorithm locks you in. We played a bit of WOW Classic last year and all of a sudden I was just flooded with Asmongold videos and videos of people clipping and replaying Asmongold. It took a day of "never show this again" to make it stop.

What corporate stuff do you have on your main page? Mine is all pretty much filled with content that matches what I watch.

Anything news related is mostly corporate now when searching. Either it's a mainstream news channel for serious news or one of the checkmarked talk shows for satire.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#289

Post by chaorace » Sat, Sep 18, 2021, 4:51 AM UTC

Wanna know how to spot an HN user in the wild? Mention Youtube and wait to see if they launch into dramatics. Grown adults getting mad at a tool for doing its job.

If you ask me, it's the same story with just about every single digital service; recommendations are never perfect, merely useful. What's more, the stakes are just so low, literally spare time. The level of vitriol feels, to me, disproportionate -- crowding out more interesting discussions.

Re: On YouTube’s recommendation system

#290

Post by schindlabua » Sat, Sep 18, 2021, 4:53 AM UTC

> Recommendations drive a significant amount of the overall viewership on YouTube, even more than channel subscriptions or search.

I wish I could organize my youtube subscriptions better. Right now everything lands in a flat feed of videos and all the stuff I feel like watching now is buried deep within 50 music uploads.

I got myself into this situation by subscribing to hundreds of channels but I also don't want to pick favourites and unsubscribe from the rest, simply being able to put channels into categories would be perfect.