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Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

nltimes.nl

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Re: Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

#281

Post by emodendroket »

aikinai wrote: post #274
ForHackernews wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a self-correcting problem, isn't it? Either those cafes and shops will raise prices and pay their staff more, or they'll close down. I've never understood why we're supposed to feel bad for "small business owners" who won't find staff when paying peanuts for their crappy jobs.

You think those small business owners are packing away substantial profits they could use to pay staff significantly more?

If a business can only exist by having serfs it wildly underpays then maybe it deserves to lose out to the big chains.

Re: Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

#282

Post by the-dude »

varjag wrote: post #276
the-dude wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure 'full write-off' is the correct term. It is tax deductable, so you are taxed less, typically max 50% of the interest sum.

That's the explanation I had from a local back in 2003. He said their whole interest part of the mortgage was eligible for tax rebate.

Still the case for PPOR, 30 years max, no interest-only mortages.

Re: Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

#283

Post by amelius »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #154
amelius wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IANAE, but I'm guessing part of the problem is also that housing is not part of inflation (i.e. not in the indexation).

It is, but it is mixed in with housing that people do not want, such as due to location, size, quality, etc. The US CPI figures have no resemblance to your expenses if you live in one of the desirable and booming regions of the US.

The Netherlands (where the article is about) is relatively small, so I'm wondering if the whole country has more or less the same "booming" factor (?)

How does housing affect inflation in that country?

Re: Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

#284

Post by pigeonhole123 »

em500 wrote: post #104
pigeonhole123 wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is the CPI a useful measure of inflation if it ignores the things people actually have to spend money on like housing and healthcare?

It wouldn't be, if it did that. Fortunately it doesn't ignore those. In the US CPI calculation, housing has around 42% weight, medical care around 9%. Source: https://www.bls.gov/cpi/tables/relative-importance/2020.htm

I think this is only rent? Most people don’t want to rent their whole life in the US

https://www.bls.gov/cpi/factsheets/owners-equivalent-rent-an...

Re: Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

#285

Post by limograf »

ForHackernews wrote: post #130
makomk wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, the British press and all the wealthy people with second homes still have Brexit as a scapegoat for why cafes and shops in tourist destinations can't find staff. Never mind the fact that AirBNB and second homes have pushed up house prices and rents to the point that it's impossible to live there on the kind of pay those jobs have, according to the media it's all the fault of Brexit driving away the for…

That's a self-correcting problem, isn't it? Either those cafes and shops will raise prices and pay their staff more, or they'll close down. I've never understood why we're supposed to feel bad for "small business owners" who won't find staff when paying peanuts for their crappy jobs.

Sure, they can raise prices but the customers who paid £350,000 for their charming holiday cottage won't pay £35 for a cup of coffee. The house prices are so out of touch with the rest of the economy, there's no way to catch up for normal people. So the cafe closes.

The self correction should actually be the house price crashing, but the UK government consistently props up, and pumps, the market.

The average house price in Salcombe (Devon) is £950,000! That's 30 average salaries.

Re: Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

#286

Post by spangry »

___luigi wrote: post #54
dmje wrote: post #25

Amen to this. Two case studies from the UK I've been thinking about recently: 1) Visiting London and spending time in South Kensington - walking back to hotel at night, only about 30% of houses had any lights on. Suggestion is the others are effectively uninhabited, and a search on RightMove shows properties sell for £20-£30m for a 4/5 bed. This isn't normal Londoners, it's outside investment. 2) Cornwall, where I li…

> walking back to hotel at night, only about 30% of houses had any lights on. I wish a data scientist at utilities (water, electricity and gas) providers pick up this line and provide some statistics on this. I wish also that city-services companies (e.g. Electricity/water/parking service provider) can collaborate to provide better and justified policy making. I did similar studies based on open data to provide insig…

There's an organisation called Prosper Australia that does analysis of 'speculative vacancies' in Melbourne using water consumption data: https://www.prosper.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/Prospe...

Re: Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

#287

Post by arp242 »

iso1210 wrote: post #149
dmje wrote: post #25

Amen to this. Two case studies from the UK I've been thinking about recently: 1) Visiting London and spending time in South Kensington - walking back to hotel at night, only about 30% of houses had any lights on. Suggestion is the others are effectively uninhabited, and a search on RightMove shows properties sell for £20-£30m for a 4/5 bed. This isn't normal Londoners, it's outside investment. 2) Cornwall, where I li…

> Round here in Cornwall the jobs are things like surf instructor, supermarket worker, barperson, etc. That's not gonna stretch to the local house prices. That was the case. A colleague of mine, originally from St Just, moved to London for work as so many have to do. Another from near Cockermouth did the same. Both now work remotely full time from their 'home towns' on decent wages. Covid has done wonders for local c…

For a small village of less than 5,000 people nowhere near any sort of city or population centre, this seems like a lot. £1,278/month is well outside the range for a lot of working class and even middle class families. The median gross salary in Cornwall was £27,223 in 2020.

I'm baffled by your comment to be honest; not very long ago I could buy a house in Bristol for the same or less.

Re: Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

#288

Post by flir »

nkrisc wrote: post #219
makomk wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, the British press and all the wealthy people with second homes still have Brexit as a scapegoat for why cafes and shops in tourist destinations can't find staff. Never mind the fact that AirBNB and second homes have pushed up house prices and rents to the point that it's impossible to live there on the kind of pay those jobs have, according to the media it's all the fault of Brexit driving away the for…

>it's all the fault of Brexit driving away the foreign workers who had to do the jobs Forgive me since I’m American, but wasn’t getting rid of foreigners taking jobs one of the selling points of Brexit?

Yup. Immigration was the issue. Bunch of other stuff around the edges like English exceptionalism.

Note that laurent92 talks about "Englishmen" not "British voices". That's incredibly telling.

Re: Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

#289

Post by ponow »

winkelwagen wrote: post #234
rusteh1 wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks. What if I purchase a home, to live in. Then I take a job overseas and move for 2-3 years. Must I sell the house rather than rent it out on a short term basis?

There are special rules for that specific scenarios. As long if you don’t live in the Netherlands yourself and it is the only property you own

Markets don't need exceptions, they adapt. With property/price/rent controls, it comes down to a committee of "experts" or it becomes effectively closer to community property with the tragedy of the commons. IMO, reduce the restrictions on new development and creative use, e.g., by cutting back on zoning to allow higher density development and reduce the ability of neighbors to stop development of neighbor properties (due to aesthetic or other concerns). Building codes and regulations shouldn't protect the consumer from himself, but rather protect the physical safety of adjacent properties. But it's too often used as an excuse to limit competition and preserve the privilege of the early entrants.

We also need to acknowledge that cities inevitably increase in density, which necessarily means apartments, etc. Protecting single-family residences near city centers is a subsidy to them that we should not pay any longer.

Re: Dutch cities want to ban property investors in all neighborhoods

#290

Post by Fnoord »

rocqua wrote: post #214
iso1210 wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There aren't mortgage tax credits in the UK, and I have no idea what you mean by "eco regulation shenanigans"

They are both Dutch situations. The eco regulation shenanigans is about nitrogen emissions. They are limited by European regulations near protected areas. The government ignored and worked around these regulations for a long time. Then environmental parties sued, and we were so far above the limits it was essentially ruled "no more emissions". Whilst building new houses causes a decent amount of emissions. This meant…

The massive shortage existed way before that lawsuit was even in the making.
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