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Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

bleepingcomputer.com

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Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#281
> "To help get GeForce GPUs in the hands of gamers, we announced in February that all GeForce RTX 3060 graphics cards shipped with a reduced Ethereum hash rate," Wuebbling added.

Is there any evidence that crypto mining plays a significant role in the ongoing hardware shortage? Any evidence at all? I see so many people complain about it, but I haven't seen any reason to believe crypto is one of the primary factors driving the shortage.

I don't mine or trade crypto. I acknowledge the many problems with current crypto offerings and have no interest in dealing with the tech until those problems get sorted out (if that ever even happens). But I inherently don't like the idea of a hardware company intentionally crippling general computing tech like this. And it's especially frustrating to see them try to spin it as a positive move for their customers.

The RX 6000 series was another huge step forward for AMD graphics hardware. Hopefully their 7000 series will be even more competitive. NVIDIA needs the pressure.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The e-Waste part is what should collectively anger us, but I'm glad you're able to buy your card.

I'm personally angry that this whole crypto ponzi scheme has gotten so big. That miners are producing e-Waste is the least of its environmental impact.

Keep being angry. It will be much larger in future, and use magnitudes more energy. Either make peace (with the drumbeat of human progression), or spend your days being angry at something you don’t understand. Your choice!

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#283
post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

> Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level?

Yes. A lot of what has angered me about the situation is that there's these claims that these companies are going to help us as consumers but aren't actually doing anything that helps us. It is just show. They know it, we know it. So stop saying you're on our side and stabbing us in the back. As an example, look at NewEgg's product shuffle. It is a clear scam and actively helps miners. Microcenter, BestBuy, Amazon, and everyone else does the same thing but NE is the worst because the bundling with useless stuff.

You want to help consumers? I have 2 models for you:

1) Create a signup list (like EVGA, but just select the number, not this list for every variant). Send out cards as they come in.

2) Only sell cards once or twice a month and in large pools (many cards in stock). This way you have a reasonable quantity of cards to hand out for the high demand instead of the small quantity that bots are always going to get to first. It should take only basic statistics to understand this. If a bot has an 80% chance of getting a product first and a consumer 20% then we need a bigger pool to draw from, not more pools (with small number of cards). More (small) pools helps the bots and harms the consumers. Larger and less frequent pools results in a larger set of consumers getting the products.

With these two models you can better fight bots and stock doesn't need to be on the shelves for long periods of time.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm thrilled by this. This has been a common approach in I think almost every industry. What nvidia is doing is recognizing that the needs of existing long time consumers / clients / partners are not being met by the current situation. Yes, it inflates short term profits and increases their pricing power, but long run if you can't buy nvidia for your dev box, your game box etc, this reduces the long run nvidia ecosys…

I suppose the "long term customers" for these GPUs are gamers, right? Don't they also come and go? I don't particularly follow this as I'm not really into games, but it seems to me that AMD has had quite an impressive growth recently. Does that mainly come from people new to the market? I'm actually a "new to the market" buyer, and I bought an AMD mostly because I'm mainly a Linux user and didn't want to take any cha…

Gamers need games to play and if gamers buy more AMD cards because high end NVIDIA is not an option then game developers will focus their efforts more towards AMD. Going by steam NVIDIA currently has three quarters of the PC Gaming market cornered, that is a lot of motivation to focus development on their hardware and an edge they do not want to loose.

https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If this works (spoiler: it won't, it will be cracked within a month), it will create more e-Waste as miners will toss their no-video-output-mining-only cards after they're no longer the latest tech, instead of being able to resell them to gamers, thinning the used graphics card market, forcing more gamers to buy new from nVidia instead of rebuying old cards online. That makes me angry, it should make you angry too.

Proof of work makes me angry. I have a difficult time getting too upset over any attempt to curtail it.

Don’t be angry. Just try to understand it. It’s all we can ask.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To add on: none of it is malicious. its just the market stabalization problem a) let's keep consumer grade stuff stable in price b) let's charge miners 3x, because they willing to pay 3x, and destroy the scalping market which is VERY anti everything. Scalpers hurt literally everyone. c) let's not de-stabalize nvidia's income again when eth drops in value. They don't want to be beholden to a coin's gamble either. Basi…

Except that miners will simply workaround the downgrade software (as they did in the past) and regular consumers will be the only ones with crippled hardware

Reading the Nvidia announcement it's not a software upgrade, but a change in hardware. It only affects cards made after late May.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#287
post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

The situation fascinates me. It's one heck of an expression of capitalist market forces. Gamers can't get computational capacity for their graphics, because the market-clearing price for computing is the value of the cryptocurrency that that GPU could be mining instead. Every pixel you calculate has an opportunity cost of that calculation's worth in cryptocurrency.

Nvidia wants to serve gamers over miners, presumably to establish and maintain brand loyalty for future purchases. If they can't increase supply, the only other way is to reduce miner demand. That's their goal; this limitation is just a technical detail of implementing that. Hardware segmenting to serve different markets has been a thing forever and I don't see any reason to call this out as any worse.

That said, I like that Nvidia and AMD are taking different approaches here. That's free market capitalism, let the invisible hand guide the outcome.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#288
post #267

It's will be funny to see how HN crowd that support Nvidia here will react when Nvidia going to cripple ML features for the sake of market segmentation.

This is exactly why I'm worried. I took an ML class last semester and having access to CUDA on my 1080Ti (explicitly purchased for gaming) was a boon for my project group, since we could actually tune models efficiently.

This might be good for the short-term, but it sets a precedent I'm really not happy with. I know they already do some of this with Quadro, but my understanding there is that the value add is in its reliability and certification, not ability to operate on workloads that have been artificially crippled on the gaming cards.

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