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The unusual ways Western parents raise children

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Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#281

Post by AnimalMuppet »

zeku wrote: post #226
rajin444 wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes you feel certain of this? I may be wrong, but a majority of human history seems to point to (roughly) "spanking is ok, anything more is not". Children do not understand logic the same as adults.

I really don't believe this is true. I was spanked my whole childhood. It never taught me one single thing, because I just wanted to know "why" X was bad and I was never told. It was no more effective than just telling me no. People use spanking as a crutch, it really has no place in the child raising toolkit imo.

Depends on the kid, and depends on when. When you were one, you might have listened to "no", but there are plenty of kids who don't. And it matters because of things like wanting to play in the street. I can't tell a one-year-old what two tons of car moving at 30 miles an hour is going to do to them. But I can train them that every time they play in the street, it hurts.

That sounds cruel. On the other hand, letting them get hit by a car is much more cruel, and not all of us have fenced front yards.

I have no problem with spanking for safety issues. But be careful, because a kid in danger triggers fear and panic in parents, and once the crisis is over, that seems to almost automatically morph into anger. Do not spank in anger, ever.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#282

Post by jimbob45 »

agumonkey wrote: post #279
gdubs wrote: post #171

One of the hardest thing about being a parent today is the constant shame and confusion about the “right” way to do it. We don’t live in a hunter gatherer society anymore, we just don’t. There’s lots of wisdom in that way of life, and sure we could learn from it — but there’s enough anxiety as it is, parents don’t need more of it. We have three kids and we sleep trained them. (Not a pediatrician, standard disclaimer.…

We are in an orthodoctic era. Lots of tensions about what principle is the best to follow, less patience and acceptance.

Would you please define that word? I can't find a definition online and I try to look up unfamiliar words to widen my vocabulary.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#283

Post by anw »

watertom wrote: post #232
gdubs wrote: post #171

One of the hardest thing about being a parent today is the constant shame and confusion about the “right” way to do it. We don’t live in a hunter gatherer society anymore, we just don’t. There’s lots of wisdom in that way of life, and sure we could learn from it — but there’s enough anxiety as it is, parents don’t need more of it. We have three kids and we sleep trained them. (Not a pediatrician, standard disclaimer.…

3 children, we only slept them in their rooms, starting day 10. Naps, day sleep, everything, they slept in their room and in their crib. The room was light controlled, meaning there was no light at all. They quickly associated any sleep with their room and their crib. We used a baby motion sleep mat for peace of mind for SIDS, the thing was so sensitive it could detect the breathing, but if the baby moved off the mat…

If you don't mind, which motion-detecting sleep mat did you wind up going with?

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#284

Post by em-bee »

bitshiftfaced wrote: post #144
PebblesRox wrote: post #100

I recommend Sweet Sleep as a resource for anyone interested in cosleeping/bedsharing. It gives a lot of practical advice and looks at the research to address the safety concerns. The conclusion is that bedsharing will multiply existing risk factors for SIDS but if those risk factors are already low, adding bedsharing into the mix does not increase the risk by a significant amount (assuming it's done in accordance wit…

I was under the impression that the risk of SIDS isn't the only thing when it comes to bed sharing. Adult beds are softer and have more give, so babies get turned over more easily so that their airway can get blocked in the mattress. There are more things like pillows and blankets that can get block the airway. And then there's of course the parent that's sleeping next to them. Do all of those risks get clumped into…

that's an interesting observation. beds in asia are traditionally harder from what i have observed, so that might be a factor.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#285

Post by carabiner »

alistairSH wrote: post #29

Of all the "weird" things we do as parents in euro/anglo nations, sleeping arrangements seems nowhere near the top. IMO, the top "offender" is over-scheduling kid's activities. So many kids in my area have their days booked solid with sports, academic tutoring, music lessons. Approaching zero free time to enjoy being a kid. Edit - and this isn't really a western thing, "Tiger Mom" and similar probably pre-dates this…

My coworker did this with her son. She was spread thin with afterschool programs, sports, projects and so on. Well, the kid got into Caltech. Where he'll probably meet amazing people and receive an excellent education. So maybe it worked? How many YC founders had this overbooked childhood? I'd guess over 70%.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#286

Post by enobrev »

gdubs wrote: post #171

One of the hardest thing about being a parent today is the constant shame and confusion about the “right” way to do it. We don’t live in a hunter gatherer society anymore, we just don’t. There’s lots of wisdom in that way of life, and sure we could learn from it — but there’s enough anxiety as it is, parents don’t need more of it. We have three kids and we sleep trained them. (Not a pediatrician, standard disclaimer.…

I'm positive of two things in regards to being a parent (and a human):

1. I have no idea what I'm doing

2. Neither does anyone else.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#287

Post by bluGill »

lqet wrote: post #165
concordDance wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> dressed You can probably even leave this one out!

As soon as they turn 2, getting them dressed does indeed require extensive improvisation :)

Long before that. I have to struggle with my 10 months old at times. She wants to crawl away and play with something (preferably something dangerous - it is amazing how easy it is for a plastic bag to end up in reach even when you are careful)

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#288

Post by spamizbad »

gdubs wrote: post #171

One of the hardest thing about being a parent today is the constant shame and confusion about the “right” way to do it. We don’t live in a hunter gatherer society anymore, we just don’t. There’s lots of wisdom in that way of life, and sure we could learn from it — but there’s enough anxiety as it is, parents don’t need more of it. We have three kids and we sleep trained them. (Not a pediatrician, standard disclaimer.…

Most of the hunter-gatherer parenting practices that get pushed on certain parenting blogs are pseudo-scientific and shouldn't be adopted. And some of claims that a baby crying is dumping enough cortisol into their bodies it will permanently damage their brains is NOT supported by science.

What does have a strong scientific basis: the importance of sleep hygiene.

Children don't need perfection or goofy hunter-gatherer hacks from their parents. They need love, support, and a measure of reasonable consistency[1] from them.

[1] This is why having alcoholic parents can be so disruptive... children get a different experience sober vs intoxicated.

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#289

Post by InfiniteRand »

gdubs wrote: post #171

One of the hardest thing about being a parent today is the constant shame and confusion about the “right” way to do it. We don’t live in a hunter gatherer society anymore, we just don’t. There’s lots of wisdom in that way of life, and sure we could learn from it — but there’s enough anxiety as it is, parents don’t need more of it. We have three kids and we sleep trained them. (Not a pediatrician, standard disclaimer.…

I think this anxiety exists in traditional society as well but instead of getting advice from books and news articles in traditional societies you get an avalanche of advice from relatives

Re: The unusual ways Western parents raise children

#290

Post by agumonkey »

jimbob45 wrote: post #282
agumonkey wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are in an orthodoctic era. Lots of tensions about what principle is the best to follow, less patience and acceptance.

Would you please define that word? I can't find a definition online and I try to look up unfamiliar words to widen my vocabulary.

Hm I improvised an adjective for orthodoxy. Maybe it's orthodoxic .. I hope you get the meaning now.
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