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How Apple, Google, and other tech companies conspired against their own workers

whenrulesdontapply.com

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Re: How Apple, Google, and other tech companies conspired against their own workers

#281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"following orders" was specifically not an excuse, hence him being convicted . He didn't serve additional time due to other technical issues in his prosecution.

What an awesome way to split hairs. "Howard Callaway, Secretary of the Army, was quoted in The New York Times in 1976 as stating that Calley's sentence was reduced because Calley honestly believed that what he did was a part of his orders—a rationale that contradicts the standards set at Nuremberg and Tokyo, where following orders was not a defense for committing war crimes.[98]" [98] Marshall, Burke; Goldstein, Jose…

Being genuinely coerced into an action against your will doesn't leave you ethically liable for your actions - you need to have some intent and will to carry out your actions for any culpability in a philosophical sense[1]. As an example, if you were to hand someone a gun and tell them (in a manner which they fully trusted your honesty and intent) that you would shoot them and their friend if they didn't shoot their friend then... you're on really shaky ground philosophically - dismissing any scenario escapes (shooting your captor, disarming them etc...) you're left with three basic options, shoot yourself, shoot your friend, and refuse to shoot and have both yourself and your friend be shot - in this case it is logical and it should be a guiltless action to shoot your friend and preserve your own life (but it's complicated by our value system).

So, excusing part of an action due to a coercion to follow actions is valid, but every time we talk about this scenario in the real world you're going to have more options, maybe you doubt your captor would actually shoot both of you - in that case shooting your friend is back to mostly being your decision - the issue occurs when this grey story is converted to black and white and people paint themselves falsely as being unwilling participants. In WW2 US soldiers could have refused when asked to participate in concentration camps, it would have been severely inconveniencing and that counts for something, but they chose the easy route and that is a perfectly valid guilt.

[1] There is a rather sound argument to be made that evil and culpability is a false construct and that we should refuse to punish any bad actors beyond the point of discouraging recidivism. If there is a common good that we all share as a "known truth" then deviations from that truth can be considered to be impairments about seeing the truth and comprehending it which would lead any deviations from that truth to be understood as a need to enlighten their view of the truth. It's quite an interesting philosophical path to head down.

Re: How Apple, Google, and other tech companies conspired against their own workers

#282

So I was at one of these companies when the scandal broke. I didn't get screwed quite so much as my coworkers, since I'd only been working there for a year or so. The settlement was a joke - I got about $1100, but my compensation increased by roughly $100K/year the year after the cartel broke, and kept rising. Can't say I'm terribly pleased about either the wage-fixing or the settlement, but... My wife works in phila…

Here's an email I sent to my city councilperson on 2017-12-01. It contains information that refutes your claim. I received no response:

Dear Aaron Peskin, I live in Supervisorial District 3, at ... . You represent me and my neighbors in your position on the SF Board of Supervisors. Your work is very important. I have lived in SF for 6 years and have seen the housing market get more and more expensive while the city's businesses have grown. Economically, the city is prospering and adding many jobs which bring workers to the city every day. Unfortunately, the city has not added enough housing for these people. Here are the numbers:

- In 2011, SF jobs increased 2% (see [1] page 5) and housing increased 0.07% (see [6] page 4).

- In 2012, SF jobs increased 5% (see [2] page 5) and housing increased 0.4% (see [7] page 4).

- In 2013, SF jobs increased 5% (see [3] page 5) and housing increased 0.9% (see [8] page 4).

- In 2014, SF jobs increased 5% (see [4] page 5) and housing increased 1% (see [9] page 5).

- In 2015, SF jobs increased 5% (see [5] page 5) and housing increased 1% (see [10] page 5).

The 2016 reports should appear at [11] when they are available.

I took Econ 101 in college and learned about the Law of Supply and Demand. It's clear to me that SF's housing crisis is caused by demand growing much faster than supply. The city has enacted many policies and programs to boost the economy, creating more jobs. It has not done enough to make places for all of those workers to live. It's an imbalance of epic proportions.

Fixing this situation is the responsibility of the San Francisco Board of Supervisors. You are our elected member of the board. Please tell me what you are doing to increase the housing supply.

Sincerely, Michael

[1] http://sf-planning.org/sites/default/files/FileCenter/Docume...

[2] http://default.sfplanning.org/publications_reports/Commerce_...

[3] http://default.sfplanning.org/publications_reports/Commerce_...

[4] http://default.sfplanning.org/publications_reports/Commerce_...

[5] http://default.sfplanning.org/publications_reports/2015_Comm...

[6] http://www.sf-planning.org/ftp/files/publications_reports/20...

[7] http://sf-planning.org/sites/default/files/FileCenter/Docume...

[8] http://default.sfplanning.org/publications_reports/Housing_I...

[9] http://www.sf-planning.org/ftp/files/publications_reports/20...

[10] http://default.sfplanning.org/publications_reports/2015_Hous...

[11] http://sf-planning.org/citywide-policy-reports-and-publicati...

Re: How Apple, Google, and other tech companies conspired against their own workers

#283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So now house prices in Mountain View and Sunnyvale go from $800K -> $2.4M, This just proves that the housing crises was the same before. A regular middle-class income cannot afford an $800k home. The problem is the same before and after: there isn't enough supply for people who want homes. Until you look at sales numbers and supply, your analysis is meaningless. Increased wages don't make housing prices increase. >n…

I don't deny that the root cause of this issue is lack of supply. I'm saying that over short time periods (and sometimes over long ones where NIMBY policies rule), lack of housing supply is a given, and so the consequence of more money for housing is not more housing, it's higher housing prices. 1% of the population being flush with cash has virtually no effect on a housing market where 5% of the housing stock turns…

What would you say the "dark horse" second or third-tier tech cities are in the US right now, the ones that still have good infrastructure and quality of life but aren't suffering from a housing crisis?

Re: How Apple, Google, and other tech companies conspired against their own workers

#284

I think the latest expression of this concept came out when a friend of mine was up for a senior role at Google and they ended consideration when they suddenly decided that he switched jobs too often to be a leader, but they were happy to continue considering him for a role beneath what he currently already had.

Isn't that a reasonable concern?

The decision is specific to that one candidate and related directly to the candidates work history.

Is there no N, where N is the number of jobs someone has had in the last five years, where you would consider someone to be a questionable candidate for a key position?

Re: How Apple, Google, and other tech companies conspired against their own workers

#285

These companies still routinely conspire against their own workers to slightly increase profits by reducing benefits, salaried roles, sick pay etc.

And employees conspire to get more by gaining experience then moving to other companies, differentiating themselves and asking for raises?

You are describing negotiation.

Companies are not supposed to want to raise wages any more than employees are supposed to want to lower wages. The balance is how the market puts a value on different kinds of work and skills.

Re: How Apple, Google, and other tech companies conspired against their own workers

#286
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So while this is bad... I don't know how to feel about this. Just to be clear: you are saying it's possibly ok for a cartel of billionaires to collude to suppress wages for a bunch of people making six figures? Because those employees have it "pretty good" and should be happy with what they're given, even though they are working to build world-historical fortunes and power for the business owners?

Exactly. I don't think people really understand the gravity of those fortunes. Jeff Bezos could now (in theory, at market prices) buy Tacoma, Washington. As in buy every piece of real estate, private and public, all utilities and infrastructure. A town of 200,000 people. One man could buy it all. The assessed property value for 2017 was just over $105B, including government-owned, plus wiggle room for other propertie…

> That "should not" be possible.

That actually seems pretty small compared to Bezos impact on global commerce.

I am all for constraints on wealth being created or compounded by political and market corruption. But see no reason to discourage or cap wealth created by productive means.

Re: How Apple, Google, and other tech companies conspired against their own workers

#287
post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have heard the NIMBY argument many times before but I just don't buy it. It's too easy of a target. Plus there is so much land. Ok fine, won't build in your backyard, I'll build in the next yard over. We have this exact situation in a town called Davidson, NC where I am from. Builders can't build there. So they built in the hundreds of thousands of acres immediately right next to it. Problem solved. Plus people exe…

NIMBYism alone also isn't the problem per say, it's zoning plus NIMBYism that makes things hard. A vocal minority can effectively block zoning changes, which prevents developers from building high density housing. This is exacerbated by CA's so-so to terrible public transit. High density housing is far more annoying for whoever lives nearby when everyone living there has a car or two and the builder didn't also build…

Zoning is one way NIMBYism can keep housing from being developers and housing prices high. They’re not separate ideas.

Re: How Apple, Google, and other tech companies conspired against their own workers

#288

These companies still routinely conspire against their own workers to slightly increase profits by reducing benefits, salaried roles, sick pay etc.

And employees conspire to get more by gaining experience then moving to other companies, differentiating themselves and asking for raises? You are describing negotiation. Companies are not supposed to want to raise wages any more than employees are supposed to want to lower wages. The balance is how the market puts a value on different kinds of work and skills.

Sometimes it's a negotiation between parties each with some measure of power, but it can also be completely unilateral like using layoffs and redundancies and shutdowns and bankruptcies as an accounting tool and not necessarily because they're losing money or making strategic changes.

Re: How Apple, Google, and other tech companies conspired against their own workers

#289
By depressing tech wages, workers are forced out of big tech companies and into smaller companies with competitive salaries but fewer open positions.

Big companies complain they can't find enough workers with their relatively low wages, and lobby for more H1b worker visas, depressing wages even further as foreign workers cannot change companies easily without moving back to their native countries first.

I can totally imagine Steve Jobs writing that email over "no poaching" to the other big tech companies.

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